We simply cannot leave the upheaval that was season six of Designing Women without talking about the elephant in the room: the cast changes. America was glued to their TVs to see how Julia Duffy and Jan Hooks would fare in place of the beloved Delta Burke and Jean Smart. Thirty million strong for that matter. We’ll discuss if they got a fair shake.
Designing Women had some cast changes, but they didn’t invent them. So we’re going to talk about some iconic ones in other corners of TV. Who did it best? Who did it worst? And, most importantly, was there drama?
Reads:
resh Prince's Aunt Viv Controversy Explained: What Really Happened
Tv major cast changes from best to worst. | by Kendall Rivers | Medium
Tv major cast changes from best to worst. | by Kendall Rivers | Medium
20 TV characters shockingly recast during the show's run | Yardbarker
Some sources for our rapid-fire casting changes notes:
And then this list of 56 actors who were recast
Come on y’all, let’s get into it!
Or listen on Apple Podcasts | Spotify | Amazon Music.
Transcript
Hey, Salina. Is it a fresh new heart attack every time I do that
Hey, Nikki.
Hey, Salina. Is it a fresh new heart attack every time I do that? Cut sound.
Yes. Keeps me young. Or peeing my pants. One of the two.
This edition of Selena Talking about Peeing her Pants is called Castaway
And hello, y'all, and welcome to this week's edition of Salina Talking about Peeing her Pants. And of extra sugar. This edition we are calling Castaway. Was that me or you? Who named this you? Oh, crap.
Why?
Because I thought it was you, and every time I looked at it, I laughed.
Oh, well, good. You laugh at yourself. That's nice.
Really don't like to laugh at myself.
I would love to take credit for it, but I don't think that was me.
I believe in our, main episode, we were talking about obnoxious things, and I think laughing at my own joke seems obnoxious.
But anyway, gift you deserve in life you get. You deserve to get to laugh at yourself when you're funny and clever.
I thought it was my gift was to be obnoxious.
Sometimes whatever you like deserve to be entertained by yourself. I think I'm funny, and other people don't always think I'm funny, so I will give it to myself.
I like that attitude. Well, I think you're funny, too.
Designing Women returns for its sixth season with major cast changes
So, the reason that it's called Castaway is because we simply cannot leave the upheaval that was season six without talking about the elephant in the room. And that is the cast changes. Specifically. Where are we on these? Like, yes, for Designing Women, but in general as well. They did it, but they didn't invent it. So who's done it best, who's done it worst? And most importantly was the drama.
It's the most exciting part.
Where's the tea? That's right.
TV shows become embedded into one's life, they're reflective of big issues
So without spoiling shows, we may discuss. I did want to, like, maybe frame up something that's been occurring to me as I pulled the segment together. And then just, like, throughout the season, as I was watching it and trying to digest, like, the absence of, Charlene and the absence of Suzanne. And that is this idea that, like, I think depending on the era you came up in, you come to things with a slightly different perspective. So for me, I came to a lot of, like, cl. Classic, quote, unquote, depending on your age, sitcoms from, a reruns perspective. And so sometimes for me, the replacement was who I thought was the original cast member.
Yeah.
And in those cases, the replacement is then who I'm used to, so I like them more. And I wonder sometimes if the evidence is actually sometimes that new cast just don't get a fair shake because viewers and fans simply aren't used to them.
What do you think?
I think, I think that has a lot to do with it. and so, you know, it's funny. Designing Women, I don't remember BJ at all, but I watched Designing Women in reruns and later shows in later seasons. So I mean I remember Allison from the reruns and again, I don't remember being like horrified by her. So I do think it hits different when you watch it the first time through. So some of the shows we're going to talk about today, I have personal experience having watched it in real time and in reruns. I've watched all these in reruns too. But I think it hits different in real time. I think that's a very valid, perspective. And it's not, it's not right or wrong. I mean, I think there are just care. You grow to love these stories and you grow to love these characters and then when they change and they don't change the way you want them to, you feel territorial or something.
Yeah, it's, it's interesting because I think we just sort of get emotionally attached.
We do. You know, we do. And it seems silly, but they do. You know, especially if you think about the way people used to watch tv, they become a part of your life on a standard routine basis. So I think about Home Alone. Home Alone, not home.
We can think about that. We can think about that.
I love thinking about Home Alone. Home Improvement and the three boys stayed with the show throughout the series. And if they had taken Jonathan Taylor Thomas away from me at some point as like a 14 year old and reintroduce some not JTT, I would have been devastated because I used to watch them weekly, Thursday night at 7pm with my whole family or whatever. So they become part of your life.
And I do think that's what's like. I mean, obviously what we're doing with some of the things that we cover is a little silly. What are you, why are you crapping on this show? But like, I mean it is like a little. Maybe doesn't seem that serious, but TV shows, they get embedded into one's life, you know, and they're reflective of big.
Situations happening in life and societal situations. It's art, man. It is art. Whether it's a sitcom or a drama, it is art.
That's right.
We've talked about how we feel about Carleen and Allison on the show
And so with that in mind, before we start talking about, other shows, is there if I don't want to belabor the point, I think We've talked, great links about Carleen and Allison, and I think we've been pretty open about how we feel. But is there anything that we want to share in terms of just talking about the cast changes, like how we feel about. About Carleen and how we feel about Allison?
Yeah, I think we've talked about a lot of it. I have two thoughts here. One, both characters are not nearly as bad as I was expecting them to be, based on what we've seen from fan commentary. So I think they're not terrible characters. I do think when we get into talking about who did it best and who did it worst, there were some themes that came to mind for me about what maybe makes a casting shift more palatable for audiences and how maybe some shows do it a little more eloquently than others do. some of it, I think, is sheer dumb luck. Like, do they resonate with the audience, or does the audience just receive them? Well, which is where I think they did Alison dirty. I think they just introduced her almost as a villain, and no one's ever going to turn, to, like, appreciate her once you've introduced her that way unless you make a real concerted, like, PR effort. Carleen was enjoyable from the beginning and actually answered some of the questions and lingering concerns we had about Charlene's character. So she was more easy to digest. I think.
I, Yes, I think that's true. I think for Carlene, I mean, if she had been there before Jean Smart, I think she would have been just as beloved.
I think that's right. I do. I think that's exactly right.
Well, I think she would have been interesting to see go toe to toe with Delta Burke.
Yeah, that's true.
I. I would have loved to have seen that.
She would not, have had a lot of patience for Carleen, would she?
No. And, you know, I think with Allison, Alison's tough. Like we said in our first episode about season six, I think, time, you know, but it is not easy to fill the shoes of someone like Delta Burke. So on top of that, the character of Allison. Well, I also talked about this. She needed a Michael Scott treatment, A little sugar to help the medicine go down. Like you said, they leaned way too much into that villainous side, and I think they should have let her cook a little more. We talked about in the main episode, they made her the straight man too many times versus letting her have the punchline when she obviously had a very storied and, career, you know, being able to be very funny. And then they just didn't give her the best use. And I think maybe they may have been headed that way, but it was just too late. She wasn't going to win over any focus groups.
Yeah, I agree. That's where they were trying to take her toward the end of the season.
Right. And I think that for me, I think I'm so glad that we did the Allison episode because I think that helped me return to the arc of her season M and realize that she had some pretty great stuff in there.
Yeah.
So, agreed.
TV landscape is too niche to capture attention the way it once did
Well, again, before we move on, eventually we'll get there to, the, you know, who did it best. I want to warn and argue that several of these are going to be older because when switches are made today, the TV landscape, it's just too niche to capture the attention the way it once did. It's like it definitely still happens, but it's just not quite the shock to the collective cultural system that it once was, you know, because, like, maybe you watch, you know, fantasy shows, but you don't watch reality tv or you watch reality tv but, you know, you don't watch, horror based television shows or whatever. So I just think that when those things happen, it's a flash in the pan and maybe you see a couple stories on it and it's gone. But these shows that we're going to talk about, for the most part, I think they were really like these stories that stayed in pop culture news for a long, long time, because we're talking about them. Hope y'all know what we're saying. so with all that in mind, are you ready?
I'm ready.
Okay. So my first pick is Cheers from Diane to Rebecca
Okay. So my first pick is Cheers from Diane to Rebecca. Now, this is really good one because we also talked in our main episode about how Julia Duffy went out for the role of Diane, and she was actually one of the finalists for that role, but eventually loses out to Shelley Long. But, you know, you thinking about cheers in 2024, I mean, this is definitely a really old show. and I, you know, you watched it with your family, right?
I remember my parents watching it.
Okay.
You were like, around watched it. Yeah. I hadn't given Cheers a fair shake because we talked about reruns and sort of relying on those. I don't remember Cheers being in reruns in any sort of meaningful way or if it came on. I wonder if maybe I associated it, with my parents as being like, oh, they like that show. It's not for old people because it's about a bar. It's about adults in a bar. So maybe that's what I was thinking. but you. So I don't. Didn't really watch it within the last, I would say probably eight years or so. I started watching it on, Hulu or wherever it is in a more meaningful way. And I can totally see why people love that show. I can see why a 8 year old or 10 year old or whatever didn't really care for it.
Except for this eight or ten year old, seven year old.
But hey, I was watching Golden Girls.
Yeah, exactly. Come on. They just weren't your old people.
They weren't my old people.
I need an old people. All old people were my old people because I was born 35. but so, okay, so just to kind of get everybody in the same frame of reference.
Shelley Long starred as Diane Chambers on the show from 1982-86
The switch is Shelley Long's, who starred as Diane Chambers for five seasons from 1982-86, but in the sixth season was replaced by Kirstie Alley as Rebecca Howe. She would go on to do six seasons of the show from 1987 to 1993. Now, the storyline of Diane's last season was set to marry Sam, but ultimately the wedding is canceled when she decides to leave him and the bar. He sells the bar, does what we all do, goes on sabbatical on his new boat, goes broke, loses said boat, comes back to bar looking for work, new manager, inner Rebecca Howe hires him as the bartender. See what we did there? I'm with you. In real life, Shelley Long left the show to spend more time with her baby and pursue a movie career.
Choose words carefully on this next bit, Salina.
The movie career unfortunately didn't exactly pan out. However, it did give us Troop Beverly Hills.
And the Brady Bunch movie.
And the Brady Bunch movie, which I.
Didn'T see in theater.
Yeah, I think I probably saw both of them in theaters.
As one should. That's the cinematic experience those films deserve.
I think the problem with those movies is there's like a hundred people in them and so everybody has about five minutes of screen time. Oh, you know, I don't agree with that.
You should re watch.
That's true. I haven't seen them since 1995.
Let's do a special episode. I also love the Brady Bunch, so it's a fun.
Well, if you do Troop Beverly Hills, I'll be willing to do the Brady Bunch.
The second one's better than the first. Carry on.
Okay, I'll keep that in mind. Does that mean we can skip the first one and go straight to watch both?
Yeah.
Oh, Good.
Fans of the show are pretty split over which Rebecca character worked best
Okay, so here is my argument for what made this fall into the best switch category. So I think fans of the show are pretty split over the two. Me, personally, I'm a Rebecca fan. I found her zany personality much more entertaining than Diane, who basically is like the female version of Frasier, except Frasier did it better, in my opinion. I think some of it is also that those early years just feel really old. It kind of reminded me about the way that the early years of Designing Women struck us. You could just feel that switch to it getting a little bit more modern. I thought Screen Rant made a really good point about why the switch worked, which was that the later seasons with Rebecca had more opportunity to explore other characters because the show was no longer hung up on this. Will they, won't they? Of like Diane and Sam? I mean, that was really where all of the energy was focused before. This is also a perfect example of a show where I saw Rebecca years first. So I didn't have the same attachment to Diane or even the fan favorite that there is in Coach. I was always more about, like, Woody Harrelson because that's what I was used to. So, that's my argument. I want you to feel free to weigh in with thoughts. I know this isn't one that you've watched a lot, but, you know.
Yeah, I mean, when I did my great rewatch, I haven't watched all the seasons. That's a lot of seasons of a TV show. but I definitely watched Diane, and I definitely watched, Rebecca. And I also found Rebecca a little more endearing. And I wonder if it's just because that's who I was used to seeing when I can remember my parents watching it. and I just think Diane is a prickly sort of, like, this is a horrible thing to say. She's sort of like the shrill female character. I think they wrote her in that way, and that's just a tough sell for me sometimes.
Yeah, I felt like, Rebecca was a little bit more of an empowered character. and I just. I just love the high drama of Kirstie Alley. So she's great. Yeah, she's kind of Elaine esque from Seinfeld, so she's got more of that. Like, I'll get in there with the boys and, like, tussle.
Yeah.
So I like that.
But I didn't have, like, in watching. It wasn't like, I'm strictly in one camp or the other. They're both fine. I think that they, fortunately were written. You mentioned this very differently from one another. So I think it, the, the medicine goes down a little easier when you're. They like retooled the entire storyline rather than trying to make it a one to one replacement, which I think we'll get into with some of the others.
And perhaps that's going into the themes that you saw emerging for sure. Who, how. When it's working and then on the opposite end of that, when it's not for sure.
Roseanne switched Becky Connor from Lacy Goranson to Sarah Chalk
Can I talk about Roseanne for a minute? That falls in that category. It's one, that works for me. And, I think for an interesting reason. So the switch is that Lacy Goranson starred as Becky Connor for five seasons, 1988 to 1992, but in the sixth season, she was released, replaced by Sarah Chalk. they didn't make up an excuse for, like, her leaving. they just acknowledge the switch really openly. the actors don't resemble one another other than being like teenage girls. but the show sort of played into it a little bit as the switches were happening, because actually, this may be later in my notes, but actually they switched back and forth a lot even after, Chalk joined the series. So in real life, Goranson wanted to go to college, so they rode around for part of season five. She elopes with her high school boyfriend, and so she kind of disappears. school kept her from coming back in season six, too, but Roseanne, the show, wanted to bring back Becky and Mark, so they replaced her with Sarah Chalk. Chalk plays the character. Here you go. For most of season six and all of season seven. Goranson returned in season eight, but decided not to do the final season. And then Chalk returned for the original final run in season nine. Sometimes it would change week to week depending on Goranson's school schedule. and so Goranson came back for the spinoff the Conners, but so did Sarah Chalk, playing a completely different character. So for me, I've watched. We've mentioned this before. I've watched a lot of Roseanne and I've watched the Conners. I think the easiest answer for why this worked is twofold. One, the producers and writers made the shift for good reasons. So Goranson was trying to go to school. She wasn't being difficult, so they accommodated her. And I think that plays really well on screen. I think when there's high drama and everyone's holding a really firm line, that makes for the awkwardness. In this instance, they did it for the right reasons. She wasn't being difficult. They just, they accommodated her and it made it really natural, but also they really leaned into it, which is my second reason they would make jokes about which Becky was showing up that week. they wrote specific references to it in the show. in the Conners, when Goranson's grown up, Becky and Chalk's other character are on screen together. There's a storyline where Becky serves as a surrogate for, Chalk's character. They made references to them looking alike. Like it was all a very meta self awareness that really made it work. so I think that's. That would be my argument for why it was one of the best. And for what it's worth, Goranson was my favorite Becky. I really didn't love the episodes where Sarah Chalk played her. I feel like it was a very different tone for the character. and I just thought, Gorenson, she's just funny and she's adorable and Sarah Chalk is great. But it just wasn't the Becky that I was used to. And this might be an instance where I watched it in real time growing up, or at least in near real time. I'm sure I didn't watch the very first two or three seasons, but I very much remember the latter seasons. And I wonder, like, if I just got used to one certain Becky. And when they changed on me, I felt a certain way. but I loved when they brought Sarah Chalk back for the Conners and just again played into it.
I will. I'm going to support you for this being the best, and I think I'm going to support it for being the very best of all the ones we'll talk about today. Today. I think it's brilliant. I think it's funny. I think that anything that's willing to poke at itself like that is worth, a watch. and I enjoyed both performances. It was like one of those ones where I would just whichever one it was was the one I was enjoying. I do feel like, Sarah Chalk brings a softness to it. and that is going to be different than I feel like, Ah. So I wasn't as familiar with her, but I, feel like the original girl, she had, a little bit more of a sharpness to her.
And that's definitely what I noticed between the two of them. I think once you're used to Becky being like that, it's hard to see her go so gentle and soft. So I think that's why the shift was hard for me. I will say Becky in the Conners is a very different character, even though it's still played by Goranson. She's. She's grown up a lot since Roseanne and she's experienced a lot. So she does have a sense of softness to her, but she still keeps some of the edge. I would have thought it was brilliant.
What a wild experience to. I think, for any of these, but maybe particularly that one. And thinking about the younger kids who have literally had that show in the back and foreground of their entire life.
Yeah.
Marking these.
Matt: It leans into some of the best parts of Roseanne
Because think about how we've talked about. We watch different shows and it hits us in different ways depending on. On the phase of life we're in. And then they're like, actually in it, and being. Experiencing it in like multiple ways.
And I. Not to make this a Connor's podcast, but we've talked before about how I think you said maybe you tried to watch a first couple of episodes or something. It just didn't really. And I said, like, watch more. It gets better. It leans into some of the best parts of Roseanne, which is really, how complicated life is and how difficult real people's issues are and that like middle class slash lower middle class struggle. And it's just done in such a brilliant way. And I think the Connors carried that through really well too.
Yeah. And I do think that's important representation that we just don't have a lot of.
For sure.
You know, and I do think that sort of. Matt, it matches the spirit of, I think, the way that maybe Southerners and Midwesterners or basically anyone who doesn't fall into an LA or New York feels, which is like, first of all, we're never shown. Then when we are shown, it's wrong and then it's. It's almost like these, like, regional microaggressions where it's like it. Sorry, guys. It just didn't matter enough to get it right in the first place.
Yeah.
you know, and that is a, a stinging feeling. And so I think for that reason there does seem to be this nice connective tissue between a show like Roseanne and the kind of things that we try and bring to light on our show too. Well, that's a. That was a nice little aside there.
David Garrison starred as Steve Rhodes until midway through season four
Excuse me. I know you had another show you wanted to talk about too, and so.
You just said you think Roseanne did it best. I think it might be tied for me, Roseanne and Married With Children. So they've replaced Steve Rhodes with Jefferson Darcy or made a swap. I shouldn't say replaced. So David Garrison starred as Steve Rhodes until midway through season four. So that was 1987 to 1990. And then he was written off the show and replaced by Ted McGinley as Jefferson Darcy for the remaining seven seasons. though, Steve did appear in two episodes in season four as a different character in the show. Steve leaves Marcy. I'm glad Salina provided all these notes for me. I'm glad you included this, because I don't remember this. He leaves Marcy to become a forest ranger at Yosemite National Park. Jefferson was introduced as someone Marcy met and married at a bankers convention. After becoming very drunk, in real life, Garrison decided he'd rather return to stage acting rather than be tied down to one show and be typecast, because of it. So the part I can comment on is what made it the best, which is that I, think generally speaking, this worked best because they just introduced a whole new character rather than replacing the actor, like swapping out an actor to play the same character, they just introduced a whole new character. And the way that Marcy and Steve met. I mean, Marcy and Jefferson met drunk at a party. Plays out for the rest of their marriage. Like, that is the character of Jefferson. They. He and Steve are genetically different. Like, Steve was almost a male Marcy. They're both uptight, borderline annoying and neurotic. Jefferson is not. He's delightful. He's a silly little boy toy for Marcy. He introduces, like, a whole new aspect to the show to explore. He and Al are buddies in a way that Al and Steve weren't. So they get into shenanigans together. and so I talked to Kyle about this because, like, he's. He's probably the married with children super fan. And that was. His general take is just like, he's just a different character, and he has a totally different vibe. And so I think in thinking about those themes that makes a character shift work. Rather than trying to make someone else into someone else, it's better just to introduce a whole new someone. That whole storyline with Cheers, like, they just reworked it and made it work for him. So.
Right. And I. And. And I think, to bring it back to Designing Women real quickly, I think they made it better than just doing this thing that we'll get to a couple examples of where they're just like, oh, we'll just put a completely different person in there. We won't make a joke of it.
Right?
We'll just drop them in and no one will notice. They're both women. It's fine.
Right.
You know, but they didn't go the extra step of differentiating. And I think that's where it really ran into trouble, especially with Allison.
Well, I think the offense off screen drama played into that because I think we talked about this, maybe in our very first episode that they had some jokes in there that apparently were too sharp for some of the cast to hear. Don't know what they were, but I wonder if they tried to play on it a little bit and it just wasn't received well. But that was 100 the issue.
Yeah, and that's a good point. Like, when this drama piece isn't at play, it's like people have the brain capacity. It must. I can't imagine how stressful it is to do all of that, like, under duress, for sure. instead of, like, accommodating someone's school schedule or whatever the case is, that's coming out of a place of love instead of this place of, like, loss and anxiety, for sure.
Nikki says Three's Company had some of TV's worst cast changes
And speaking of loss and anxiety, this seems like a really good time to talk about the worst cast changes. so the first one for on my list is Three's Company. And this actually takes a couple of twists and turns. So first we start with Suzanne Summers. We moved to Jenna Leigh Harrison and then to Priscilla Barnes. So, Nikki, were you a Threes Company kind of gal?
I was not. When this show came on, I would always turn it.
Okay, so I loved it. And I watched reruns almost every day when I was like, I want to say probably like 8, 9 or 10, something in there. And at some point, right between being whatever that point is, like in between little kid and tween, you know, and so I just got bit by the Nick at night bug. And I was watching a ton of, like, classic sitcoms. Here's the switch. So you have Suzanne Somers, who plays chrissy snow for five seasons, 1977-81, followed by, Jenna Leigh Harrison as Cindy Snow for seasons five and six, which is 80 to 82. And then finally, Priscilla Barnes is Terry alden for seasons six through eight. So 81 to 84 in the show. When Summers left, they just wrote her out without any reason. Her place in the apartment was simply taken by her cousin, Cindy Snow. You know, it's the cousin clause. I can't tell you how many times I've moved out. And my cousin is just like, right there in the wings, you know, the.
Designing Women treatment, for sure.
That's right. This room's open, right?
I'll be there.
so Harrison would also be written out of the show. The storyline was that she left to pursue her dream of becoming a veterinarian, continuing to Visit through seasons 2006. And then Barnes would join in her place as the new roommate. But, you know, sassy, clever, and a nurse. And then in real life, Summers was fired for asking for equal pay. So John ritter was making five times as much, 150,000 to her, 30,000 an episode. Where did she was fired?
The audacity. Equal pay.
It's so disgusting, isn't it? Yeah. And not that she. And I want to be clear that, she, as far as I read, was supported by the cast for asking for it. It's just that when she went and asked, she was fired during negotiations, but then forced to return to finish the season escorted by a guard and not allowed to see anyone. She was isolated to a little side set. And in an interview many years later, she recalled the show had asked her during these negotiations, who do you think you are? John Ritter is the star of the show. Harrison, on the other hand, this is who comes into play. Her cousin was later written off because the producers felt she was inexperienced and unseasoned. Yeah.
Would you pay for.
So, what made it the worst, I'd say, is what they did to Suzanne Somers. but also the switch from her to Harrison is maybe one of the more disastrous ones on tv. Summers had a certain magic that just couldn't be replaced. And, I do want to say that while they got that incredibly wrong, what almost made it to my best switch was from the Ropers, played by Audra Lindley and Norman fell, to Mr. Furley, played by Don Knotts. So that one has a little T in the background too. Even though the switch was good, which was, those two actors who played the Ropers actually went to do their own spin off, also called the Ropers. And then later, contract issues came up after the show was canceled, and so they just kind of went with Mr. Furley because he was one person to Pay instead of 2. Anyways, we'll link to an article on that. I think there might have been some issues going on, some issues behind the scenes. but Three's Company for me is like this other example where I saw the Later Years with the final replacement for Suzanne Summers. So I saw Terry first. I saw Mr. Furley first. I loved Mr. Furley and the Ropers equally, but I can even remember, like, when I moved from the Terry episodes back to the Chrissy episodes, I didn't like it at first. And then I realized how superior she was at doing what she did, this idea of playing the dumb blonde, but she was no dumb blonde, you know, and it sorta is like she brought, like, a, wit to that character that not everyone could do. That in some ways, makes me think of the things that Delta Burke can do that no one else could do with that character.
The Fresh Prince went from Janet Hubert to Daphne Reid
Nikki, would you like to take us into our next worst?
Yes. so we have the Fresh Prince. We went from Janet Hubert Whitten to Daphne Maxwell Reed as Vivian Banks, AKA Aunt Viv. so Janet Hubert played Aunt Viv for the first three seasons, and then Daphne Reid. Reid played her for the remainder of the series, which was three more seasons. So they never really gave an explanation. This was one of those situations where they just flat out, replaced the character. They didn't poke at it like Roseanne did. They didn't acknowledge it in any way. so this one is really complicated. And I started trying to dive into it a little bit to understand it, and it's just still to this day, I'm not sure anybody actually knows what happened. but it was rumored that Hubert and Will Smith clashed. And so this is why I say it's complicated, because they did address it during a reunion special on HBO Max in 2020. but I don't know. Okay, so what happened was Hubert opened up about tough things that had been happening in real life at the time. She said she was pregnant in the third season in a, quote, very abusive marriage. those things led to her acting differently on the set. She said, I was no longer laughing, smiling, joking, because there were things that were going on that nobody knew about. she also said that NBC offered her a, quote, really bad deal, but also wouldn't allow her to take on other jobs. She shared that she was never fired. She was let go. so Smith at some point told Jet magazine that she brought her problems to work. And, then she fired back and said that he got her fired. so I think that was sort of the earliest version of everything. And then the 2020 version was her actual side of it. Either way, it sort of sounds like maybe they figured it out between the two of them, or at least have agreed to disagree on the facts that happened. I think this is a situation when you think about what makes it one of the worst, the drama of it all. I think, again, like I said, once it gets played up in the media, like with Designing Women, like with this situation, whoever steps into that role is not going to meet somebody's expectations. and that puts them at a disadvantage.
M. Salina: I noticed a retooling of Aunt Viv
I think that M. I, as a watcher of the Fresh Prince, also noticed a retooling of the character with no acknowledgement. So I recall Aunt Viv being very different in early season versus later seasons. in the early season, she's more intense. I feel like. I remember she's very, just, like, career driven and very strong personality. Aunt Viv of the later seasons is a lot softer, so I actually preferred the softer portrayal of her. I think it just made the storylines feel better. But I think there's a certain subgroup of viewers of the show that much preferred the more, intense, earlier version of Aunt Vib. But I think there was no explanation, and they just flat out replaced her and there was drama going on. And for all those reasons, I don't think it really landed, with some viewers and some longtime fans of the show. So it wasn't done the most beautifully and articulately.
Yeah. And I think. So looking into that one as well, it did seem, again, like it had some connective tissue with what we saw go down with Delta Birds in that there are these really pivotal pieces missing from what makes it to the public. It's also not necessarily anyone's business, you know? and I think that people take, like, these really strong stances, even though they. Right. And not having been there. But, yeah, certainly it's not a good look. And it's just, like, really never a good look look to just throw in a different person and be like, this is fine.
This is her.
This. Yeah, it's the same person. What? You can't tell? I mean. Just maybe a tad problematic all around.
Yeah, I agree.
One of the worst.
Salina, I said it.
You win. Nikki, you win. my.
My final pick was Two and a Half Men
My final pick was Two and a Half Men. Let's get some men in here.
Let's do it. We're just talking of a lot of women, probably women.
A lot of women not being paid equally. You know what I'm saying? so, this is Charlie Sheen to Ashton Kutcher. Cards, on the table. I always felt this era was a bit of a low point in sitcoms. I would watch this show, but mainly because there was, like, not many other sitcoms on at the time, which you can make the same argument for now. So long. It's like 100 years.
I don't know how.
Yeah. The main draw for me was Jon Cryer because he will always be a Duck man for me, AKA Ducky from Pretty in Pink, AKA Connection to Annie Potts. But I digress. you have already said that it was on for a very long time, so you were a big fan.
I'm not sure I've ever seen a whole episode.
Oh, really? Yeah.
That's not for me.
I think you'll be fine. You may or may not know it, but I'll give a little side fact here that, So my dad is, like, a huge Chuck Lorre fan and, like, has been to several tapings of many different Chuck Lorre shows. Yeah, he really loved mom, and,
It was a good show in the first.
That was a good. That I've watched the whole thing. Oh, yeah, that's a. I like that one. Because if you're talking about people who are facing, like, real issues. Yeah, that's a really good one. But Charlie Sheen is actually supposed to be, like, a Chuck Lorre compared. So Chuck already got his start. Okay. Charlie Sheen is a guy who is, like, a jingle. He made, like, a big fortune off of some random jingle that he wrote.
Wait, okay. In the character in the show.
Okay.
I was like, I don't think Charlie Sheen made his money.
I'm so sorry. That was very confusing. But he did, too. And I think he, like. I think Chuck Lorre may have been the one who wrote the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles theme song. it's a banger.
From 2003 to 2011, Charlie Sheen played Charlie Harper on the show
So just, going to say, anyways, that's not what we're here to talk about, but I just thought I'd drop in a little fact. The switch is Charlie Sheen, who played Charlie Harper. They didn't go very far in the well for that one for the first eight seasons. So that's 2003 to 2011. Followed by Ashton Kutcher as Walden Schmidt for the final four seasons. Not sure where they came up with that name from, but okay. From 2011 to 2015, on the show, they pulled. They pulled a classic, but like a soap opera classic. They killed Charlie apparently struck by a train in Paris. Kutcher joins as a recently divorced dot com billionaire who helps Allen and Jake cope with the death of Charlie. he buys the house where they've all lived for the entirety of the show in real Life. According to EW, Sheen was let go from the sitcom in 2011 after making a string of statements referen referencing drug usage, as well as criticizing CBS and Two and a Half Men producer Chuck Lori. It's been so long that I think I got this earlier debacle confused with the 2015 Tiger Blood extravaganza. Whoo. That was a time Charlie Sheen had a,
He had a tear there for a little while.
Yeah. He was making the news. so for me, what makes this one the worst is, like, I've seen both versions of the show, and I would say it's just challenging to recreate the. Even though I'm not. Not necessarily the biggest fan, the chemistry between Jon Cryer and Charlie Sheen was real. Like, and it was good. but also, I think. So that chemistry never really landed for me. I did watch some of the Ashton Kutcher for the first season anyway, just out of pure curiosity. And I just. And maybe they. I'm sure they warmed up more to each other, and it was a little bit better. But,
But also, Kutcher never feels like he has a ton of chemistry with people. I don't know what that's about, But I watched that 70s show, and I also watched the Ranch with him. Both are watchable shows. Watch both of them. But he has a little flat a lot of times. M. He doesn't ring true with a lot of other people.
I thought he had chemistry. And it makes sense with. With, Mila Kunis. Sure. You know, well, they're married now, so there was something there. but. And I just. I really. I don't. I don't think I. I don't even remember the last time time I saw him in something and I missed the Ranch. but also, it was a good show. I've heard good things about it. but for me, like, what also made it the worst, really, is the way that things blew up and how public all of that was. It just makes it impossible to make a transition like that seamless. especially with such big names involved. So. Talk about being taken out of the world of a show. and the last I'll say about it is, to your point, when you say a long, long time. It was 12 years.
Yeah.
And that's a really, really long time for a show to stay magical.
It was also like 2003 to 2015. I don't remember. My math's terrible. But like, 2015 or something, which is different decades too. Like.
Massively different periods of time on either end.
Right. And then I'd like to sneaky Pete in one. Honorable mention, if that's okay.
Sounds dirty, but okay.
Not Pete and Pete, we took that a whole different way. You're me. M. And I'm you.
Dixie Carter reportedly clashed with Gary Coleman on Different Strokes
so a Dixie Carter is actually replaced by Miriam Mobley on Different Strokes, and they're just switched in to play the character Maggie McKinney and this one did have some tea. So people say that Dixie, Carter left due to Designing Women, but the lore is that she and Gary Coleman often click clashed, leading to tension and animosity on this set. I didn't know that until a listener had reached out and told us on social media a few seasons back. And I went to go find some more in preparation for this segment, but there really isn't a lot because she would refuse to talk about it in interviews.
Who did Dixie Carter think she was? Gary Coleman. He's the star of the show.
What does she want? Equal pay. So, Mariam Mobley. We also get another connection there. So if that's not. Is not hitting you right out the gate. She is the person. Well, first of all, she's Miss America. Okay. But she also guest starred in season five, episode one as Karen Delaporte, the historical society tour guide, or as Julia put it, the bored housewife who had turned her house into a theme park.
Oh, boy.
So can I do a couple of rapid fire cast changes, please
So can I do a couple of rapid fire cast changes, please? So this is more like early season cast changes that have happened through the years. I think when we were conceptualizing this segment, the first, a couple things popped into my mind, and I realized what differentiated them from these that we're talking about is that these, the ones we just talked about are the more like, genetic differences in the show. These are real quick. Like, these change super fast early in the show. Some of them you might not even know. So I thought we'd run through a couple. Suki on Gilmore Girls. I think most people know we love a Gilmore Girls moment, so it's worth mentioning. Melissa McCarthy wasn't always Suki St. James. In fact, Alex Bornstein was our original Sukie. So Alex is, of course, the delightful voice actor who provides the voice of Lois on Family Guy. She was also Susie Meyerson on the Marvelous Mrs. Maisel, which I know you watched Salina. So at the time they filmed the pilot for Gilmore Girls, Alex was also under contract at MADtv, and it was a contract she couldn't get out of for Gilmore Girl, so they just replaced her. The original pilot she filmed went unaired, but she did go back throughout the. Come back throughout the series as a harpist and as the stylist, Ms. Celine. I'm pretty sure, like, 99% sure. I've seen some of that unaired pilot, and the chemistry was not the same, between her and Lauren Graham. So I think they made a reasonable replacement.
Yeah, I'll take McCarthy if I can get Her?
Yeah, for sure. similarly, a Gilmore Girls adjacent swap was Maura Tierney was swapped for Lauren Graham on Parenthood. So Tierney originally played Sarah Braverman on the unaired pilot episode, but bowed out because of health issues.
Oh, I didn't know that. Okay.
Damon Wayans Jr. Was an early cast member of the Fox show New Girl. He appeared in the pilot of the show, but was substituted in the second episode by Lamorne Morris, who played the role of Winston. This was because Wayans had appeared in Happy Endings, which was picked up for a second season on abc. if I remember correctly, it was a straight substitution. Like they barely even addressed the swap between the two characters. But, Wayans does come back intermittently after Happy Endings was canceled after its third season. I, love Winston so much.
I love Winston. I'm actually in the middle of a New Girl rewatch right now and can confirm that there's not really a ton said.
Yeah, it's pretty quick. Ross's ex wife Carol on Friends. So Carol was originally played by Anita Barone, who was replaced by Jane Sibbet. Anita actually only portrayed Carol in one episode, Episode two, where they set up the complicated situation between Ross and Carol. Anita chose to leave the series to try to land a bigger part on another series, which she did as Karen on the Jeff Fox worthy show. But that only lasted a season because when it left ABC for NBC after the first season, she was recast. So Jane would go on to appear as Carol in at least one episode a season for the first seven seasons of Friends. That was never the original intention. In fact, she was really only expected to show up in a handful, of episodes. So there was no way that poor Anita could have known that when she set her sights higher. Otherwise she may have made a different choice.
Morgan, the little sister on Boy Meets World disappeared with season three
Morgan, the little sister on Boy Meets World. I, think in looking through stuff for this segment, I have come to terms with the fact that it's not super unusual to cast, different kid actors as a show progresses, particularly as kids grow up. Like they just sort of fall in love with other hobbies or whatever. but sometimes it's really obvious, which for me, because I was a Boy Meets World fan, was really obvious on Boy Meets World. the Morgan that viewers had come to know, Lily Nixie, disappeared with season three and her character wouldn't return until, episode 14 in season three when she was replaced by a totally new actor, Lindsay Ridgeway. So I do think I remember the show poking fun at the Morgan character a time or two. Like they explained her absence for most of season three by saying she had been in a really long time out. but this was a definitely a situation where the character came back completely different. The early Morgan was like super snarky and mean, like a really mean five year old. but when they came back with this new character, she was like a lot softer and super intermittent after that.
Ann Veal on Arrested Development was played by two actors
this one surprised me because I had forgotten it. Ann Veal on Arrested Development was played by two actors in the first season. Alessandra Turasani played her in Let Them Eat Cake, but May Whitman stepped in to play her in the remaining 16 appearances scattered throughout seasons two through five. The running gag with Anne, for anyone who hasn't seen it, is that she's unmemorable. So the original thought with the actor playing her was that it could change from episode to episode. So, like, the producers thought it would be really funny to just have a different Anne every time she showed up. But it turns out Mae Whitman, they just thought she was really good at the whole unmemorable thing, so they just kept her. So May Whitman did an interview later and she was like, I mean, I guess the joke was on me because I was the most unmemorable.
She's delightful.
And then I handpicked just a couple for you, Salina. These are, these are personally tailored to you.
Game of Thrones has had 11 actors recast over the course of seasons
Oh my.
so Jerry's dad was swapped early in the Seinfeld run.
So Morty was briefly played by Phil Bruns back in season one, but was replaced because Jerry Seinfeld and Larry David wanted the character to be crankier, so they brought in Barney Martin. And then did you know Game of Thrones was like, super known for recasts?
some caught my attention at the time and then others have caught my attention over the years. And some because of the way that people's like the mountain. Like, it's hard to tell him from season to season anyway, but he's like one. It's changed several times.
But 11 actors were recast over the course of the season. 11. Okay, so you just mentioned one, the Mountain. He was recast three times. He started out being played by Conan Stevens, who had scheduling conflicts in season two. Ian White took over and pulled double duty as a giant wildling named Dongo. And then ultimately an Icelandic actor whose name I am almost certain to ruin. Yeah, Hoffborg, Jorgensen.
this seemed pretty good.
He took over in season four and he's ultimately the one that got the best part where he crushed Oberon's Oberyn's skull.
Is that the best part?
It's the most exciting part.
Yeah.
The mountain was terrifying.
can I guess? Can I guess?
Sure. Yeah.
A couple. Okay, so Sam's brother, the. He's like something. Darlington. He gets replaced. Sure. and then, well, that just mean that there's like a hundred instead of eleven.
That's true.
And. But the one who's the most clear for me, that felt like the biggest switch because they look so different was, ah, Daenerys's lover. who was like the warrior.
I wouldn't help you.
Dario Nahara.
Oh, I don't have those.
Oh, that's not on the list either. Okay, well, he was a blonde with long flowing locks at the end of one season, and when he came back, he was a fairly well known short brunette guy, like, with like a completely different.
Why?
I don't know.
Well, it just doesn't make sense. Never made a show, but that seems to not make sense to me.
Right, okay, so who are all the ones I'm missing?
Barrick Dunderi.
Who was played by David Michael Scott in one episode, then swapped out for Richard Dormer.
Oh, okay.
And then the Night King was swapped from Richard Break to Vladimir Furdick.
Okay, that's hard to tell with all that makeup.
Previously had portrayed the first white Walker that Jon Snow killed. Yeah, the, the Night King was really tough. I looked at the pictures and I was like, that's kind of hard to tell. Barrack Dondarium. And I can't remember it right now, but it was a character that I remembered. And it looks. He looks noticeably different.
Oh, interesting.
Okay, so that's the end of my list.
I wonder if I just thought it was like a completely different guy.
Yeah, you know, maybe.
Okay, well, this was fun. I like talking cast changes. So let's just see how these holidays shake out
Okay, well, this was fun. I like talking cast changes. There's a lot of them out there and there's many more. I'm sure that if you've been listening along, there's some that you might be screaming at us, like, how could you not come? So, like, tell us about it. Track us down. We're findable. we will also link to some articles in the show notes for your perusal. If Nikki, decides she likes you that day, we'll see. as a reminder, come back the first week in December for our conversation with Brandon over at Front Row Classics. You should also be able to catch our episode on his show later this month where we discuss the 1949 Joan Crawford led noir Flamingo Road. And then we are also Toying with the idea of a special episode on Troop Beverly Hills. So let's just see how these holidays shake out. Nikki, if I'm saying anything wrong, because, again, end of a long workday.
Hold me accountable seems right adjacent.
Okay, great.
Good enough.
Good. Something's happening, guys.
I think it's right. Thanks.
In the meantime, you know the drill. So DM m us, email us or contact us from the website and find us all over the socials. And that is this season final extra. Ah, sugar.
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