S8 E3 - Golden Girls: Dorothy Zbornak – Queen of Deadpan

Dorothy Zbornak could level a room with one withering stare — and finish the job with a single sarcastic comment.

This week on “Sweet Tea & TV”, we’re diving into the world of The Golden Girls’ resident truth-teller — the tall, tough, totally iconic Dorothy, played by Bea Arthur. We’ll unpack what makes her the glue (and sometimes the eye-roll) of the group, why her brand of honesty hits just as hard today, and how Bea made this sharp-tongued realist into one of TV’s most beloved characters.

We’re covering it all — the good, the bad, and the gloriously snarky. From her most heartfelt moments to her best zingers, we’re celebrating everything that makes Dorothy… Dorothy.

Plus, stay tuned later this week for an “Extra Sugar”, spotlighting Bea Arthur herself — the woman behind the wit, the voice, and the world-class side-eye.

And, as always, thank you for being a friend!

Or listen on Apple Podcasts | Spotify | Amazon Music.

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Transcript

Salina welcomes season eight, episode three of Golden Girls

Salina: Hey, Nikki.

Nikki: Hey, Salina.

Salina: Hey, y'. All. And welcome to season eight, episode three. I have that right, don't I?

Nikki: Yes, you do. I was gonna say episode three already. Yes, that's right.

Salina: Okay, according to the top of my notes, this is also cards, on the table. The first time that Nikki and I have met virtually in a while. So we're ripping off all the band aids, so please bear with us.

Nikki: and they're like, waterproof band aids or something. Waterproof band aids that have been on a long time, so they're coming off really painfully.

Salina: That's right. and so you're welcome. Anyone who's listening, you're so very welcome. But this is a quick, and good time for a program reminder that we have shifted our focus from the south to instead follow the unforgettable women of television wherever they lead us. And our first pit stop has been Golden Girls. You can learn more about this transition both in our new prologue episode. You can also find out which Golden Girl you are. as well as our season opener where we talked about the series as a whole. I'd also welcome everyone to check out our episode dedicated to Blanche. We also have two extra sugars just sitting there, just ready for you, just waiting.

Nikki selects a handful of favorite Golden Girls episodes to watch in advance

but today we are moving on to another iconic Golden Gal in an episode that we're calling Dorothy Zor Zorn. I'm new to Golden Girls. Queen of the deadpan and probably queen of pronunciation. She seems like she's on top of it. Maybe Nikki did select a handful of Dorothy episodes to watch in advance. especially for our purists who want to watch before listening. This. That list included Season 1, Episode 5, the Triangle. This is the one where Dorothy's new boyfriend hits on Blanche. so Bea Arthur was nominated for the Emmy for Outstanding Lead Actress in a Comedy Series for this episode. They really need to shorten the names for those.

Nikki: They do. That would be.

Salina: They're long.

Nikki: That would be helpful.

Salina: Yeah. Season, two, episode five. Isn't it romantic? This is the one where Dorothy's friend, who happens to be a lesbian, falls for Rose. Season two, episode 13, the Stan who Came to Dinner. The one where Stan stays with the gals while recovering from a bypass operation. Bea was nominated again here for an Emmy for Outstanding Lead Actor Actress in a Comedy Series for this episode. And then in the next episode we covered was season three, episode 15, Dorothy's new friend. The one where Dorothy's new friend is a pompous butt. I will say that I almost Wait, that too anti Semitic, you know, But I just summed it up as a pompous butt.

Nikki: Okay, fair enough.

Salina: A pompous, racist, anti Semite. You know, she's all the things.

Nikki: She's a well rounded friend.

Salina: That's just the kind of friend you don't want to have.

Nikki: Exactly. A well rounded frenemy, I should say.

Salina: Right. and I almost missed that one because when I went back and I saw the title, I thought it was the one about her friend that hit on Rose. Oh, right.

Nikki: Yeah.

Salina: Or who falls for Rose. Hit on Rose. Sounds so cheap.

Nikki: Yeah.

Salina: so season three, episode 17, my brother, my Father, I was. That's tricky without the context. You know, it is. This is the one where Dorothy and Stan pretend to be together for the sake of Sophia's brother, who is also the priest who married them. So no fathers who are actually also brothers. Thank you, Jesus. and then be won the Emmy for outstanding lead Actress in a comedy series for this episode. Season seven, Episode two, the Case of the Libertine Belle. This is a fan favorite and a Nikki favorite, so there you go.

Nikki: I love the murder mysteries. I love getting out of the Miami house. You know, in Designing Women, some of my favorite episodes were when they left the Designing Women, the Sugar Bakers, design firm. So. And I also remember loving that this is an episode where Dorothy just gets to shine. She gets, like, her singular moment in the sun, which I appreciated.

Salina: Yeah. Okay. I love that. I was curious what all. I should have known that the leaving the house was part of it.

Nikki: it's part and parcel.

Salina: Although I will tell you that it bothers me less to be in the Golden Girls house than the Designing Women house.

Nikki: Okay.

Salina: I don't know why.

Nikki: So they do explore different rooms in Golden Girls, and we just. We only got, like, one or two in Designing Women, but all of the women have their own room. We get to go to the kitchen. It's. It's a big set.

Salina: I like being in the kitchen. Yeah, right. There's something there.

Nikki: Cheesecake, I'm told a refrigerator full of things. It's my favorite place to be.

Salina: Exactly. And then, And I think you already said it, but again, this is Dorothy in the case of the Libertine Bell. She is living out her whodunit novel dreams. So you should have seen. I'm not really into those. You should have seen me trying to remember, like, the big outside of, like, scene. I can't even remember right now.

Salina: Sherlock. M, like, outside of Sherlock. I'm like, Ugh. I can't remember any of these people. I'm like the who done it stuff, you know? and then season seven, episode 24. This is the last one we did, which is good because we're running out of series. You know, the one who flew out of the Cuckoo's Nest. This is the series finale. It is a two parter where Dorothy and Blanche's cousin accidentally fall in love, leaving the girls to figure out what's next. Turns out it was golden palace, but.

Nikki: Yeah, for a little that one.

Salina says the season finale was a tough one to watch

Salina, I. We're gonna talk about this one. I think, maybe in our extra sugar for the season finale. So I don't think we're gonna spend a ton of time here, but I feel like it made sense to go ahead and rip the emotional trauma band aid off for you for this one. And judging from the text you sent me when you watched was tough, tough watch.

Salina: I don't even know how I would. I've seen, like, okay, whatever I've seen over the course of my life, which is probably all in all, 20 episodes over 40 years. Okay. So that's not a ton, honestly. And then add to that now I've probably seen 14 episodes since we've started this. And I'm just crying.

Nikki: Just.

Salina: And I think I was, like, multitasking, so I was, like, crying and, like, folding laundry and like, somehow I was like. I was watching everything on my phone and somehow my bathrooms. I'm, like, texting you. I'm, like, cleaning the mirrors. I'm like, oh, this is the best thing.

Nikki: Oh, well, then you didn't even get the full experience if you didn't watch it fully draw your attention.

Salina: I'm not sure I could have handled it.

Nikki: It's a tough watch.

Salina: Yeah, I was already crying.

Nikki: I don't ever watch this episode ever. I just. I can't. So this is the first time I've seen it in forever. It was as sad as I remember.

Salina: Yeah. and I don't even think at first I realized it was the finale and then there was a second part and then I realized the number and I was like, oh, my God, this is the final. This is the final, final, final, final.

Nikki: You just needed to go ahead and rip it off early on so you know where this is all headed. Yeah.

Salina: Well, I'm excited to talk about it more in depth when that time comes. and then we'll just pick you up off the floor.

Nikki: I won't be watching it again. We should have to use my memory.

Salina: I've been done.

Bea Arthur was originally conceptualized as a Bea Arthur type

Do you want to tell us then, a little bit about our gal?

Nikki: Yes, I do. so Dorothy, first of all, played by the incomparable Bea Arthur, you're gonna do a much deeper dive into B for this week's extra sugar. it's deeper than what I've got here, I'm sure. I hope. I hope we'll find out, you know, what surprises. suffice it to say, she is truly the only actor who could have played Dorothy. so Dorothy is sharp to the point, I think sometimes a little caustic, like almost a little. Feels a little mean. but she has a lot of heart, especially for the other Golden Girls. and as it turns out, she's the only actor who could have played Bea. Could have played Dorothy, because Dorothy was conceptualized as a Bea Arthur type. that's actually what the casting directors were charged with finding as the show was getting off the ground. Isn't that crazy to imagine your name, like, on some casting director sheet as go find a Selina Smith type?

Salina: Good luck.

Nikki: Well, yeah, they couldn't. They couldn't. And so they would end up with the Selina Smith, which is what happened with Bea Arthur. They couldn't come up with another Bea Arthur type.

Salina: Yeah. Can I add a little color to that?

Nikki: I don't think this actually is.

Salina: I, want to say beautiful, beautiful color. just that I think it was Susan Harris who specifically noted the Bea Arthur type. And that I wound up watching, like, an intimate portrait about Bea Arthur.

Nikki: And that is a blast from the past.

Salina: You know, I was like, oh, intimate portraits. I forgot about this.

Nikki: Why don't we do this anymore?

Salina: I was like, this is beautiful.

Nikki: The production value.

Salina: Yeah. She winds up finding it when someone sends her the script. The note is in there.

Nikki: Oh, that's funny.

Salina: And it says, we're looking for a Bea Arthur type. Isn't that amazing?

Nikki: That's really cool. And so I think we might have talked about this in the first episode. but they originally didn't. They didn't just come right out and ask Bea Arthur to do it because they assumed she wouldn't want to do another mod type role. so that's why they just went general looking for a Bea Arthur type. So it took them a while to. To get her on board, which I know we talked about.

Salina: You get the. The only type. The one type.

Nikki: There is the one and the only.

So we've been talking about the archetype that each of the Golden Girls fills

So we've been kind of talking about the archetype that each of the Golden Girls fills. so in terms of archetype with Dorothy. So we're going to add to our Southern belle of Blanche, who we talked about last week. Dorothy is sort of, in my opinion, the voice of reason. in fact, the Golden Girls fandom wiki called her the den mother, which I thought was sort of a nice, like, contemporary way of talking about the voice of reason. She's a truth teller, a realist. She brings everybody back down to earth when things get too ridiculous. She also suffers no fools, especially Rose, and she's quick to shut down silliness with a witty, sarcastic one liner. Does any of that feel kind of what you're thinking about her?

Salina: Well, so absolutely. All of that perfectly lines up. I also love the den mother reference. I think that's fair and right. And some of it, I think, is even just the fact that she is. I, She's tall and, like, in. I think, in some ways. And all the other women seem kind of short, so. And it feels like very like, I'm here. I'm your protector. Yeah, there's something about that there.

Nikki: I don't know how you feel when we're together. Do you feel like.

Salina: I feel short.

Nikki: Oh, okay.

Salina: Oh, and protected. But don't you feel protected when you're around me since I'm always threatening to beat up people for you?

Nikki: That's true. You're actually far more feisty than I am. I think people should know. Do you remember Ace, Ventura II one. It's been a while reference that didn't age well. That. That movie didn't age well. But there's this one, warrior fighter in the movie who's, like, very tiny, and they tell him that he's going to meet this warrior fighter, and this guy walks in, and he's huge. And Ace is like, oh, no, it's going to happen. And then the guy turns around and pulls off this basket from his back, and this tiny little guy comes off, and he's just raring for a fight. That's who you remind me of.

Salina: This is sweet.

Nikki: I'm going to find it, and I'm going to send it to you.

Salina: Okay. I mean, I kind of can see it. I mean, I really don't think I've seen that movie since I was 10.

Nikki: I wish I could say that.

Salina: You know what? That's what I love about you, because it is a little unexpected, honestly, with the rest of your personality. so you hang on to that. That's special. That's your inner child right there.

Nikki: That is what that is.

Salina: so I. For this exercise, for me, I. I don't. It's probably cheating, but I did a little Googling around just to see, like, what is the Internet. They're smart. No problems there.

What do you think about the archetypes of Golden Girls

What did they think about?

Nikki: They say a lot of things.

Salina: They do say a lot. So what do they think about the archetypes? that she might fit without looking. I would count her as the intellectual of the group. She's like the Athena of goddesses. She's strategic, she's purposeful. When I'm thinking about TV shows, like, because in thinking about the direction that we're headed with the show, like, where else we might we find her again? Well, we've already found her once with Julia. You know, she's very in that archetype with Designing Women or the Miranda on Sex and the City, maybe even the Monica of Friends. Oh, yeah, you know, yeah, it's a little looser, but she's kind of like a den mother.

Nikki: I thought for sure you were going to say Joey.

Salina: So, very close. You know, they're just like neck and neck. maybe even like a Claire Huxtable was also coming to mind for me. they just have a presence. humor and sarcasm are her tools, her weapons, and she wields them decisively. That also kind of jumped to the top as I was getting to know Dorothy. Also, all of these women, I want to be very clear. I may have not watched, golden, Girls on Repeat, but. But their characters are larger than life, so they're very in the culture. So it's not like I had no familiarity. she's obviously very caring, which is something that you mentioned, Nikki.

Nikki: Ah.

Salina: And she means a. She maintains a soft spot, you said, for the girls, but even for someone like Stan, who quite frankly, in our list of episodes didn't always deserve it.

Nikki: You know, in our list of episodes and in every episode, Stan appears.

Salina: And, yeah, I felt like I missed some narrative, but I was like, some things have happened. I think you mentioned this, but Google tells me that she's the rational leader. She's the voice of reason. I agree with that. She is the intelligent warrior. she's practical, grounded, loyal. It also said her quote. I thought you might like this one. Her quote, stable nature and strong sense of responsibility mirrored the Earth element of Taurus as she stands firm in her beliefs and values, her home and stability. yep, I think that's accurate. And also, I'm just going to give a little plug for Tauruses, which is what I am. And Then I'm off. I'm going to connect myself to be Arthur, because we were Both born on May 13th.

Nikki: Oh, I didn't know that.

Salina: 1922.

Nikki: All right, all right. I'm not giving you that one, but I didn't know you guys had the same birthday.

Salina: I didn't either until recently. Yeah. So I knew, like, Dennis Rodman. Oh, and Harvey Keitel.

Nikki: Trying to remember. I have, Neon Dion Sanders. You said Dennis Rodman, and that made me think of, Neon Dion.

Salina: Wouldn't it be something if you had another Golden Girl, though?

Nikki: That'd be awesome.

Dorothy defied traditional femininity in The Wizard of Oz

Salina: And then this was my last thought, was actually, like, more about the subversion of archetypes when it comes to Dorothy. So she defied traditional femininity. Some people point to her height or deep voice, and that's fine. But I think the more swaying piece is her more quote, unquote masculine reasoning versus the expected nurturing and emotional roles that are assigned to women. so I thought that, for me, that's been a fun difference. And watch in a character that I just very much am falling in love with as m. I continue to watch the series, so.

Nikki: Oh, I love that. I love that.

Dorothy's loyalty comes up lots throughout the series

I think you touched on. I'm kind of scrolling down because the other thing we were going to talk about is, like, the good. The not so good, and maybe where she falls apart. I think you touched on a good bit of this. so for good, I think you mentioned her intelligence, for sure. Her loyalty. she's deeply caring. I think that we, see this the most in your face in the finale when she's sort of, like, coming back in and sort of embracing the girls and not ready to leave them, and she just really wants to continue protecting them. She's sort of the glue that holds it together, but it comes up lots throughout the series. Rose, obviously spins out a lot in these weird ways and needs to be reined in. Dorothy is usually the one to do that. If it weren't for Dorothy, Sofia would be at the dog track all the time. Dorothy is the. The one who pulls Blanche back from the brink of, like, total vanity. Often, she's a bit of a moral compass. a lot of times she's pushing her friends, like, really bravely pushing her friends. I had to back up a little bit and realize, like, put myself in that, like, storyline, and would I have the bravery in some of these instances to point out to my friends, like, the mistakes they're making or, did you see it this way? She does that and it's so brave, but it's because she loves her family and friends so much that she shows up for them. and so that's maybe the good stuff.

I think one of Dorothy's greatest weaknesses is maybe her self doubt

Did you have any more of the. The good that you wanted to mention for Dorothy?

Salina: I agree that all of that's correct. I think the way I think of her is unapologetically authentic.

Nikki: Oh, yeah. Love that.

Salina: You know.

Nikki: Yeah.

Salina: she just has. I don't think. Okay. You know how you were like, you're a Dorothy.

Nikki: Yes.

Salina: Let me tell you what I feel is, like, when I have something to say, my throat will literally burn if it doesn't come out. And I just think that she is that.

Nikki: Yeah.

Salina: Like, and I'm not. Like, I wish I had the gems that she has, and I wish that I had, the level of humor that she does, but I, like, I can almost see it in that character that she's just like, nope, it's got to come out. And there it is. and I. And I do think that that works, in her favor as the good. so, you know, it also doesn't seem ego driven to me. It seems like, again, this, like, being compelled. It's. It's her truth. And I sort of imagine that justice ranks very high on her list of values.

Nikki: Yes. So I agree with that. I will say counterpoint to you kind of seeing it as not ego driven. One of the things that I pulled out around where she faul falls apart is I don't know that it's necessarily ego. It's more insecurity. I think one of Dorothy's greatest weaknesses that I see is maybe her self doubt. So the divorce from Stan clearly brought a bunch of baggage with it, and I think it made her, Especially after how long they were married, it made her wonder a lot of things about herself. I think she also is often the smartest person in the room. We talked about her intelligence, but because of that insecurity, sometimes it.

Salina: It.

Nikki: It's a. A, lash out, you know, like, with a harsh. A harsh comment. Yeah, it's. It's something aggressive. So I think, like, underneath that toughness is just a woman who wants to be seen and valued. But sometimes that insecurity kind of makes her a not so great friend. like in season one, episode five, the Triangle, she's a downright awful friend to Blanche when she vehemently doubts that her doctor man came on to Blanche. So, like, she has all these insec. Insecurities about relationships, and then you've got Blanche, who, like, always thinks men are after her and that insecurity, with this personality, they come together and causes Dorothy to act the absolute worst. That said, the vulnerability also gives her character, like, a good bit of depth because it pulls her back from just being a ball of sarcasm and puts the sarcasm into context. There's a purpose. It's her armor, but it does make her kind of hard sometimes.

Salina: Gosh, it's just stunning writing, you know? Yeah, it's stunning.

Nikki: So good.

Salina: Yeah. I'm so with you. I think, there's a cruelty in her delivery.

Nikki: Yeah.

Salina: that I think is hard. I mentioned this, I think, in our first episode and separately, that someone was trying to get somebody to listen to our podcast and said we were going to be doing Golden Girls, and she had already pulled away from it because she said they were too mean. And when I think about some of those Dorothy moments, I'm like, it wouldn't make me not listen.

Nikki: Right.

Salina: Or in Watch. but I get it, as being, like, maybe a little hard to take, especially if you're more. If your archetype is Rose, you know?

Nikki: Right.

Salina: I think it would be a little tougher. I also. This is again, where I'm just like. You're like, insecurity. I'm like, yep, check. Sometimes it comes off too mean, huh?

Nikki: Uh-huh.

Salina: Yeah. Sometimes you go a bridge too far, huh?

Nikki: Uh-huh.

Salina: Yeah. All those things.

Nikki: I think that's why I saw it so clearly, because I'm like, oh, I'm a little bit of that, too. Like, we probably all are, but shades. Yeah, exactly. But I could see it, and I was like, oh, that. That's what's happening. And I don't know that casually watching it through my life. I've really put that lens on it and given it that much thought, but I. I think that's where it's coming from.

I feel like her character falls apart for me when she's judgmental

Salina: Yeah. She doesn't have as many, like, these flaws that are so like that. I feel like her character falls apart for me. But the closest to that is when she, like, throws around, like, slut.

Nikki: Yeah.

Salina: It's tough.

Nikki: Yeah.

Salina: That's a tough 2025. Listen, I. You know, I. That's a. It's just. It's just. It's mean. So those are the most bothersome moments to me. I agree with you that those are definitely. Most of those are coming out of a place of insecurity. Sometimes. I really do think she just thinks that's funny. They do really like to bag on Blanche a Lot.

Nikki: Yeah.

Salina: For her sexuality.

Nikki: Yeah. I think that, that judgmentalness is, one of the not so shiny parts to me. I think it makes her sort of a, more of a well rounded character because she is intelligent, she is more progressive thinking until she's not. And then she's very judgmental about things.

Salina: She's Julia.

Nikki: Exactly the like in those instances, the exact same character. 100%.

Salina: Yeah.

Nikki: do you have any more good, bad, not so great that you wanted to share?

Salina: I don't think so.

Dorothy is finally diagnosed with chronic fatigue syndrome in the series finale

Nikki: Okay. I was just gonna mention a couple of her shining, moments from across the series. I think we're gonna talk throughout our season, different pieces of this, but just to sort of put it all together as the character of Dorothy, she has this really beautiful storyline where she's defending sort of her knowledge and agency of her own body against a doctor who dismisses her symptoms. she's finally diagnosed with chronic fatigue syndrome in that episode. But it was really groundbreaking as an episode for, empathy for the patient side of things and also realism. So we're going to talk about that one in our issues episode later this season. But that's a real shining moment for Dorothy. And I didn't put it here because I wanted to put it in that issues, episode, but I didn't want to lose it. In her storyline, she also has this ongoing relationship with her mother, Sophia, which I think, I think a lot of women at our age and above can maybe identify with this relationship because it blurs between frustration and affection pretty aggressively. And, it's just kind of a beautiful relationship to watch play out on screen. and then that final scene in the series finale when she says goodbye to the girls before leaving after marrying Lucas. I thought that she played that with so much grace. And it's pretty understated, but still funny. It's super. It's an emotional TV farewell. And I'm actually a little surprised that she didn't win an Emmy for that performance. I thought that was kind of beautiful. instead, you mentioned she won the Emmy in 1988, for whatever episode that was. My father, my brother, my brother, my father, the father, brother.

Salina: We just call that one ew.

Nikki: So the last thing I kind of wanted to mention. Did you have something to add there?

Salina: only something stupid. Would you like me to move forward with that?

Nikki: Do it.

Salina: Just only that, like, what could have been going on that year is that they were giving someone else their flowers who, you know, hadn't had them yet. Maybe it was their Last season of television. There's so much I feel like, political that goes into those.

Nikki: Yeah.

Salina: says, like, the ultimate outsiders outsider who knows nothing.

Nikki: I think it's a fair assumption that a lot goes into that.

Salina: So that was all.

Nikki: Okay, thanks.

Salina: thank you so much.

So I did a bit of digging into what Bea ever said about Dorothy

Nikki: So I did a bit of digging into what Bea ever said about the role of Dorothy. I kind of did this with Blanche, too, and Rue Mcclanahan. I didn't actually find that much. So I'm hoping maybe you'll surprise me a little bit in Extra Sugar this week. Whether you surprise yourself, too. We'll see. what I did find was there was maybe a little bit of a disconnect between the character of Dorothy and who Bea saw herself as compared to what we learned about Rue and Blanche. So, remember, Rue said, you know, like, Blanche is just sort of me out there saying exactly what I think all the time. I found a 1986 People magazine interview where she said, be said, I'm always cast as an imposing woman, but I'm very shy unless I'm on stage and omnipotent. I hate to do talk shows because I don't know what to say about myself. and then I mentioned to you that one of her concerns with Golden Girls was playing was, thinking that she might be playing mod 2.0, and that Betty and might also be playing similar characters to past characters they've played, and she was worried that they were being typecasted into something that they had already done. that was allegedly her concern was typecasting. But I also found an article where she said, Look, I'm, 5ft 9. I have a deep voice, and I have a way with a line. What can I do about it? I can't stay home waiting for something different. I think it's a total waste of energy to worry about typecasting. So it's entirely possible maybe she changed her mind at some point, or maybe she was just kind of sharing some of Dorothy's righteous indignation. You mentioned, like, that justice thing. Maybe she was just feeling that for other people and wanted to Mama Bear ruin Betty a little bit, but wasn't so worried about herself. I don't know. But I just wanted to share that because I thought it was sort of an interesting, disconnect in the story.

Salina: I. I think it's very interesting. I also feel like if I'm 5 9, I'm throwing that all over the place.

Nikki: Nikki. I just. I put it right there on my forehead.

Salina: I just.

Nikki: You.

Salina: I would just Like, I've had people meet me before and be like, I thought you'd be taller, you'd be taller. That's the exact kind of energy I.

Nikki: Want to bring in.

Salina: So if I really had it.

Nikki: Oh, I don't know.

Salina: I don't know. There's something scary.

Nikki: There's something very powerful in being told, I thought you'd be taller. So I think that's kind of cool that you get to hear that.

Salina: It is cool. And then I stand up, and I'm, at your armpit, and you can just push me over with one hand so I have a little color in context to add to that, if that's okay.

Spornak: Dorothy had a sincere appreciation for the character

so I also didn't really find too much, but from a very light search, because I'm really not going to talk about Dorothy a lot in my extra sugar. or. What I really wanted to say is, it's my extra sugar this week, you know, just to screw with you. I found out that she had a sincere appreciation for the character. She called Dorothy the Great Leveler. She called her a voice of reason as well. So that means that we're spot on in case you were worried. In case there's a test. and, she also caught even the Great Balloon Pricker, who called out hypocrisy, injustice, and.

Nikki: Say it again. Say it again three times, fast. I can't.

Salina: The Great Balloon Pricker. Does it sound better with an accent?

Nikki: Yes. 100. Whatever accent that is.

Salina: Prick.

Nikki: Er, same page city. I had that quote pulled out, too.

Salina: I don't, I don't even like M. I saw some rumors. I don't have still cut proof of this or anything, but it said that she challenged scripts that were sexist or reductive and that she passionately protected the character of Dorothy to make sure she wasn't just some stereotype, which I feel like falls in line with what you said of making sure that they weren't getting, like, painted, into a typecast, you know? so I kind of love that. I hope it's true.

Nikki: Dorothy Arden, Mother Dee Arthur, our den mother.

Salina: Queen of deadpan or something.

Nikki: Queen of deadpan or something.

Salina: The Bornak.

Nikki: You're trying for too many syllables, Spornak.

Salina: It's because I'm Southern.

Nikki: I know. I know.

Salina: The Bornak.

Nikki: You'll get it one day.

Salina: I won't. Ah, don't dogs call her Dorothy Z.

Nikki: There you go. You can just call her Dorothy from the Golden Girls and everybody will know who you're talking about.

Salina: I, could really Just say Dorothy. You know, there's another famous one.

Nikki: Yeah.

Salina: Something about a tornado and shoes. A Tin Man.

Nikki: Yeah. Yeah.

Top three Golden Girls moments that stuck with each of us

Salina: so, okay, top three more moments that stuck with each of us. And this could be whatever you want. I kind of have my own certain bend on it. And I'm assuming you did, too. It was. Can I tell you a challenge that I'm having in this exercise? A lot of times when it's their episode, but it's like they're the. The story force, and it's like the funniest parts, and it doesn't have to be comedic, but the funniest parts are happening around them. It's like Sophia's reaction to things, you know? And there's been a couple times where I'm like, oh, my God, do I need to get down all of Sophia's lines? And I'm like, sophia will get her turn.

Nikki: Yeah, she will. And I think what we're gonna find actually, though, when we get to that group of episodes, because the way I'm doing it is sort of like, as you saw, as we were preparing for this episode, and I realized one episode wasn't quite right in our list. I'm sort of like, remove, like, shuffling things around or whatever. But I read this quote, where, the actor that played Sophia said Sophia was always sort of the supporting, character. I never saw her as one of the girls. She was always just sort of this person in periphery doing these things. I don't think any of the other Golden Girls saw her that way, but I think she saw herself that way. So I think we might see, as I start finalizing that list of episodes, that may be the case, that her funniest moments or her biggest moments were actually supporting other storylines. We'll see.

Salina: That's fair. That's fair. I don't care. As long as the Burt Reynolds episode makes it into her batch.

Nikki: Okay. You hear me? Fair enough. I hear you.

Salina: Okay.

Nikki: I'll hear it again when I'm editing this episode, and I'll write it down. Perfect. Got it.

Dorothy shines in her scenes opposite Stan, particularly in episode 13

Salina: So I was, for me, for Dorothy, I really thought that she shined across her scenes opposite Stan, particularly in season two, episode 13, the Stan who Came To Dinner. I really enjoyed her growing frustration with him across the episode. She's like, chill, but not having it. And what a complex. What a complexity that must be to play because he's admitting all this cheating, and it's, like, slowly dripping out, like. And it's like, oh, sorry. Also this one and that one. And, like, The. And I'm like, you know, they're divorced now, but there's also the previous version of Dorothy that probably wants to hit him with her car. You know what I'm saying? And the way that she was able to play, that I thought was pretty cool, pretty good. And I. My only suggestion is that she had nudged him harder in the groin with the bag that she had packed for him. I was like, why are you packing his bag? Pack your own bag. You're not. You haven't had your surgery yet. M.

Nikki: What is so impressive about her delivery is that she is so withering without being physically emotive or, just aggressive in any sort of way. Because that struck me in the episode, the triangle, when she sits down, this man is standing up, and she takes a seat of power, is what it felt like to me. And she just said, get out. She never got, like. She never raised her voice. She never stood up and, like, aggressively did anything. She just, with her words and almost with her tone just says, like, I have nothing to say to you. You can leave now. And that's how she handles Stan a lot of the time, too. Until he pushes her just a smidge too far. And I think I ended up with a few of those in, some of my favorite quotes from her this, throughout the series.

Salina: So on that. One of my top moments was. It's maybe the last scene of that episode, he tries to convince her that he. He wasn't faking it. I mean, he was about being sick for longer, but he's not taking advantage. He's lonely. And that's where she responds. Stanley, Stanley. You know, in all the years we've been together, I don't think you've ever opened up to me this way and poured out such crap. You know, she's just. She's so good.

Nikki: She, suffers no fools.

Salina: She doesn't. And I. But I gotta tell you, it was so good, the lead up, that I really thought that she was about to, like, legitimate because she is kind of easy on him throughout the episode.

Nikki: You were expecting she was gonna go, like, full on crazy.

Salina: Yes. And I was like, oh, please least don't. and then my last one, for like, these top moments is season three, episode 17, my brother, my Father, also now known as.

Nikki: Ooh.

Salina: the back and forth again between her and Stan after Uncle Angelo forces them back into the same bedroom is just really good. And, like, I think they're just everything. She's just like, let, you know, get on the floor, like, like any dog. Like, you know, she says something about, oh, he said something about pulling out the big guns. And she says, I'm familiar with the big gun. And just like everything that she says, including him going, good night. And she goes, oh, shut up, shut up. It's just so good.

Do you feel like that was the right episode for her to win on

Nikki: I wanted to ask you, if you felt like that. I'm glad it made it to your list. That episode in particular, do you feel like that was the right episode for her to win an Emmy on based only on what you got to watch? Understanding she had other moments.

Salina: I was surprised.

Nikki: Yeah, me too. Because the other one that you mentioned, I gotta get the title right. Where he has surgery. The Stan who came to dinner. I thought their interactions were so much better in that episode that if it was going to be a Stan driven thing that got her an Emmy, that was better. But I also think she had, like, way better moments throughout the series. So it surprised me. That's the one. Yeah.

Salina: I never really. I'm. I'm usually like, if we ever get to this point where it's deep enough, where it's like, episode level or even the fact that they're episode level to me is weird. Why does it have to be for one episode? Yeah, because, you know, all these people are thinking broader performance anyway.

Nikki: Yeah.

Salina: You know, strange.

The other episode that I really thought was a highlight for Dorothy was episode two

Nikki: The other episode that I really thought was a highlight for the character of Dorothy, I sort of mentioned earlier season, season seven, episode two, where she solves the crime, it was just where she was able. One of the few times, at least in this short list of episodes that we watched, where she was able to move with full confidence and come out on top, which I feel like she needed that win. so she had a lot of physical humor in this episode and a lot of really funny barbs with Sophia that were top notch. m. But I think because Sophia was sort of challenging her throughout the episode too, like, you can't figure this out, blah, blah, blah. And then she does. And you could just see her walking with confidence and pride that she earned and deserved. And I thought it was just a super episode. It was a funny storyline. It was a pretty good, like, murder mystery, as much as it could be. and for her to come out on top made me really happy. So I really liked that performance. And then her goodbye in the finale, I just can't get over that. I genuinely believe Dorothy was leaving. Like, this felt like a true goodbye. And some of the back backstage stories, some of that was a surprise to the actors that were on stage with her, which I hope we'll get a chance to talk about at some point. Some of that, final scene surprised them. And so what you are seeing is true reactions from them. It felt so true. And I felt like I was saying goodbye to a friend.

Salina: Yeah, I love those, moments and shows where you see the person behind the person come out. And that's, you know, I. You could see the emotion just written on everybody's face throughout that episode.

Nikki: Yeah.

Salina: And it was just a lot of that episode makes my cheesecake moments.

Nikki: Yeah. So, yeah. so that was my. Those are my highlights for Dorothy.

I had several outrageous Dorothy quotes on the show

Salina: Okay, what about other observations as you see fit?

Nikki: so I had several outrageous Dorothy quotes. She's wild.

Salina: Lay them on me or us. All of us.

Nikki: Season two, episode five, Isn't it Romantic? so again, where her, friend is, attracted to Rose, there's this spot where Blanche says, I think I'll retire too, to do my facial packs and compresses. It takes me an hour. But that's why my skin is as smooth as a baby's bottom. That must explain the urge I have to sometimes diaper your head. I lulled at that one while I was watching it. I usually will give a show a hearty chuckle. That was an out loud guffaw. She's.

Salina: Ah, it's also just the delivery.

Nikki: It's. The delivery is so much of so many of the lines in the show.

Nikki: Season three, episode 15, Dorothy's new friend. When the girls were talking about Blanche having met Arnold Schwarzenegger and he declined to sign her thigh, Dorothy says he was probably intimidated to see a thigh bigger than his. So one body shaming. Do not co sign. That said, this is where I talk about her pulling Blanche down. Back down to earth.

Salina: That's right.

Nikki: And every now and then, Blanche needs a little bit of that. Which also leads to my final outrageous quote, which was season seven, episode two. Funny. You don't seem to mind being the brunt of limericks. And Blanche says, well, that's different. That's poetry. Loved it.

Salina: I also had several. I had season three, episode 17, my father, my brother. and so this is Stan comes in, he has the new toupee on, and he says, you think it makes me look more intellectual? Oh, absolutely. By the way, Stanley, your fly is open. There's more to it, but go watch the show. then we get, in season two, season. Sorry, Season seven, episode two, the Case of the Libertine Bell. Lots of good ones in. In here. This is Blanche's Southernism and Dorothy's reaction. Oh, I do declare, your sweet woods could charm the morning dew right off the honeysuckle. And that was good, Blanche. Now do Brayer Rabbit. Totally, by the way. And then this is after Blanche gets accused of the murder. and the lady says, that tramp murdered my lover. I know Blanche Devereaux, Lieutenant. And this tramp is incapable of committing murder.

Nikki: Oh, mean.

Salina: And then from season seven, episode 24, when they. It's. It's when she's talking to Lucas and she's summarizing what everyone has taught her. We've all learned a lot from each other. I mean, Ma taught me that life does not end because you've reached a certain age. And I've become much more comfortable with my sexuality because of Blanche. And Rose has taught me. Rose has taught me. It's not important. No, wait, no, no. I can do this. Rose has taught me, let it go. I need some time with this. anyways. And then she goes, a square knot. Rose taught me a square knot. And then my final one was her in her Goodbye to the Gals. and, honestly, you know what? I'm not gonna go. We'll save that one for later. But it was just really. That one was beautiful and less funny, and I liked what she had to say it. What I'll say about that is, to me, it encapsulated what fans thoughts were about the show, but it was expressed through Dorothy.

Nikki: Yeah.

Salina: and it was really beautiful. And, I hope that we get to revisit that when we kind of wrap up the series as a whole.

Where was Dorothy at her most extra for you on the show

what about Pete, Dorothy? Where was she at her most extra for you?

Nikki: So I think we've touched on some of this. When her insecurity is wrinkled, usually by Blanche, you get the most extreme version of Dorothy, definitely when she interacts with Stan, which you've brought up a few times. so season one, episode five, the Triangle, she was at peak Dorothy a few times. So, like, there was one point where Blanche has gone shopping, and she comes back in and said, I would have called you girls, but all they had left were petites. So what did you buy Blanche? Shoes. and then season three, episode 17, the barbs between her and Stan were just particularly sharp. So, Stan told her the novelty toys that he sold provided for her and the family for many years, and she very gently reminded her him of the many stewardesses it provided for as well. And she just did it again with that, like, understated grace and that Even tone. It was less the quote, more the, delivery. similar to your toupee quote that you pulled. Stanley, you're a pig in a cheap suit. You know, for two cents, you could buy a better toupee. So every time they get together, it's just, like, perfect. And then their interaction in the limo before the wedding where they have this beautiful, like, kind of moment where he expresses what she's meant to him. You can see it's really. She's absorbing it. And her final sort of moment with him, she plucks his one final head in his forehead. And I thought that was, It was a beautiful bow in their story was wonderful.

Salina: for me, I think her peak was the murder mystery episode. Just the whole thing for me was like that. And it all seemed like a nice, positive bend, you know?

Nikki: Yeah.

Salina: but honestly, my number one for her is when we find out that she and Lucas have named their sex because it's so good. And I, like, really? I was like, should we have named this episode the Freddy Peterson? Because I feel like.

Nikki: And if, you know, you know, sort of thing.

Salina: Yeah. Like, we really. We may mess that up. I don't. Missed opportunity. Yeah. But that, like, made me laugh so hard. and I think for me, too, it's like. I agree, the peak is, like, a lot of. When you think about Dorothy is definitely these insecurities. But I really liked how Lucas brought out this more positive side in her.

Nikki: You know, there was a lot. In that particular episode, there was. There was a fair amount of peak Dorothy, because when they first get on their first. Like, when they're on their first date, she is everything Dorothy usually is. She's sarcastic. She's uninterested in, like, anything the male species has to offer. She is so annoyed that she has to be there. One of my favorite quotes was, I've never felt more silly than I do right now. And the reason I love that quote is because that man came in and put the bib around her. And then Blanche finding out this whole thing is happening. I just don't know what to say. And Dorothy says, well, whatever you decide, make sure you start with Aunt Dorothy. It was just like banger after banger.

Salina: Very true.

What didn't age well with Dorothy on Designing Women

well, let's talk about what didn't age well with Dorothy. I mean, we talked about it to some extent, but what's what tops your list?

Nikki: Top of the list was what you mentioned earlier. The slut shaming of Blanche. That wouldn't play as well today. I think it's a little bit Forgivable in this context. Even watching it today, I didn't have the same reaction to that. And I'm curious if it's because I give this show such a pass, because it's such a. This, like, soft spot for me. But, like, if this had happened in Designing Women, I would have been like, absolutely not. It's so horrible. But in this context, it didn't feel that offensive most of the time to me. It also just fit with the meanness that her character can sometimes have. So that was top of the list.

Salina: That's fair. I. So I think we've already mentioned both of the ones that made my list. It was just that for someone who is usually fairly progressive, and just the natural flow of things, a lot of people, not everyone, but a lot of people do get more conservative as they age. But I don't think that's true for Dorothy. she just seems to be on the. On, like, a more understanding side of things. And then for her to not believe Blanche at all and just lay into Blanche the way that she did. And I don't think it hit me too terribly hard on the first watch, but on the second watch, I was like, oh, this is pretty rough. and I honestly thought. I was like, I need a good word for this. And it was just, like, disappointing. was my. Like, okay, this word for me is very fitting of the situation. And then I was a little surprised in the Stanley who came to dinner, how quickly she fell into that subservient role of hand on, you know, waiting on him hand and foot. Like, we don't get to see a lot of it, but we hear about it because they're all doing it and all annoyed about it. and obviously he's had a surgery, and so that changes the situation a little bit. But, like, I think it almost felt like a glimpse into who she was as a wife, which is probably why she was even more frustrated with his running off with a flight attendant. Yeah.

Nikki: Ah.

Salina: I think it.

Nikki: It is a reminder that Dorothy is a carer and she cares for the people around her. but I. I hear what you're saying. I also think that the triangle. There's a reason that's insane season one and doesn't come up later in the series. You almost wouldn't have believed that storyline if it came up later in this where it fits in the first season. Like, they don't really know each other all that well. If you think about it, like, they all have. Haven't really. We're Only a couple episodes in, so. That's right.

Salina: Well, they're confused on their own timeline. Yeah, but. But yes, I think that's still early on stuff. Also, it just feels like this. Well, that people go to. Yes, we both like the same person.

Nikki: Yeah. Yeah. That, was certainly not Top Golden Girls.

The way they handled the Gene plot line in Isn't It Romantic was perfect

I will say that I think I did this in the Blanche episode too, but I want to give flowers where they're due and talk about something that did age well and maybe surprisingly well. I thought the way they handled the Gene plot line in Isn't It Romantic was kind of perfect. They did acknowledge that this, this, could have been an awkward situation. Just like any sort of unrequited crush or love situation could be awkward while carefully managing sort of the lesbian of it all. This is a thing. It's a factor in this circumstance. But they didn't make it feel like this crazy thing.

Salina: Yeah. So this would have been 1986. And these women are older, you know, these aren't 20 or 30 year olds. I thought this was incredibly progressive. And if you're okay with that, I think it will also segue nicely in the cheesecake moment.

Nikki: Sure.

What I noticed was a lot of love for Gene and Sophia's friendship

Salina: But I just, I want to give Sophia her flowers. This, because she is like, she does make some jokes about it, but I. What I noticed was a lot of love for. You said her friend's name is Jean. Okay. for Gene and like, for. And a lot of reverence for that friendship. Didn't really seem to be judgment, you know, and even got to go and talk about, like, what if, what if, like, one of us were gay?

Salina: And got to have that. And that for me was my cheesecake moment. because she said, like, gay or straight, she's going to love him no matter what. And then she tells her to shut her big fat mouth so she can go to sleep. Which I just thought was perfect.

Nikki: Yeah. Yeah, it was, that interaction I thought was beautiful. I also thought it was, funny when they said, When Dorothy said to Rose, rose, I'm sorry, but I didn't even know if you'd know what a lesbian was. And Rose, she has like zero judgment, zero disgust about this whole thing. Rose is like the same exact wide eyed, beautiful person that she always is.

Salina: She said, well, I could have looked it up.

Nikki: Like, I just thought that was a really nice way of dealing with ignorance without making it cheap in some sort of way.

Salina: You mean the way that Blanche thought they meant Lebanese?

Nikki: Well, I don't know if I've ever met one. That scene was hilarious.

Salina: It was really good. And I think that actually is really true to the times because definitely, like, I've had conversations with my grandparents and, like, they were significantly older when they learned what it meant to be someone who was gay. Do you know?

Nikki: Must be hard.

Salina: So it must be hard, Kansas man. I don't know.

Nikki: I will say. Well, since we're talking about things that didn't age well, it is worth mention mentioning that throughout the series, there are references to Dory's Dory, to Dorothy's brother Phil. It's a long standing plot line that he cross dressed and they make a lot of kind of cheap jokes at his expense. And if I remember correctly, it can get cringy. And because I am giving Golden Girl such a pass on so many things, I feel like it's. I probably should do my due diligence and call that out. We didn't get it. Okay. I think. But it came up here.

Salina: Okay. Yeah. I think I've only. Maybe I have heard one or two references, and they were so small that I almost missed them.

There were some cheesecake moments on the show for me

But now that you say that, what about cheesecake moments for you?

Nikki: season one, episode five, the triangle, sort of the latter half of that whole episode was cheesecakey in the sense that, Dorothy and Blanche's friendship and Roses by extension, went through this really challenging thing. But they worked through, through it. But each one of them had to be part of the solution. So, Blanche reminding Dorothy that she had been a really good friend. Friend to her, and she didn't appreciate Dorothy taking the word of a stranger over hers. Again, talking about what must be hard to do with your friends, saying, that takes a lot of courage. And standing up for yourself like, that takes a lot of courage. And it was, a beautiful element of friendship. Rose absolutely refused to stay out of their fight, and she put herself out there with Elliot to get him to tell the truth down to the. Is there something wrong with your leg?

Salina: It may have all been worth that for Rose to hit on. I can't even remember her lines were. But something like, you want me? Go get a picture of me.

Nikki: A Polaroid of me.

Salina: I wonder. I just knew it was something, like, so ridiculous, but, like, perfect, you know? And then just like me trying to hit on someone would be so bad. Probably worse than that. Would you like to see a picture of me and my silk cap at night with my retainers in?

Nikki: I can show you my bonnet. and then Dorothy and Blanche had a heart to heart at the end of that. That was really lovely. And Then Rose came in and they had a group hug. And it was just heart eye emojis for me. I thought it was very sweet.

Salina: I love that.

Nikki: when Blanche and Rose tried to talk some sense into Dorothy about her friendship with. With Barbara in season three, episode 15. So that took a lot of bravery.

Nikki: That'S it. That took a lot of bravery. And it was like, just in general, the fact that they were able to call out this behavior and help Dorothy see it. When Dorothy just, again, was not willing to see what was right in front of her.

Salina: Dorothy was not being very Dorothy. M. Okay, because. And I think. I think in some of that, it is like that insecurity, like when she was being able to hang out with someone who was more prestigious.

Nikki: Yeah.

Salina: I think that was, like, it was a little bit of a. A, carrot. That was too much for her at the time, especially with that intellectual piece. I don't think if it had just been, like, a local celebrity or something, but we're talking about a book author. also that restaurant. Can I say, because we're not going to go into. Deep into all of the things. But all those names on that menu pissed me off. Oh, they were so stupid. I was like, this is not fancy. This is dumb.

Nikki: It felt like a pop up bar.

Salina: Right. I did not. I was not into that. So I just need to get that out while I have the opportunity.

Nikki: I understand. That's fair. That's fair.

Salina: And Hemingway's herring or whatever. I was like, what is happening?

The entire finale was one big cheesecake moment

Nikki: The last thing I was just going to mention was that the entire finale was one big cheesecake moment. When Rose and Blanche had their moment on the lanai and Sophia cried at the wedding.

Salina: Or Sophia out there on the lanai.

Nikki: Oh, yeah.

Salina: Oh, my God. That one was the one that I think really shook me. because what is she. She's sitting at the table by herself and she's looking at their pictures and says, goodbye, my girls. And I was like, I'm not gonna get by. It's just.

Nikki: See you later. Oh, my God.

Salina: Just the whole thing. Sophia and Dorothy also have their heart to heart when she tells Dorothy she is gonna stay. I thought that was really sweet. I love the thing with Stan. I thought that was great. That actually really surprised me. I was very nervous that Lucas was gonna leave her. Oh. Because this was all new to me, me, you know? And I thought, like, I wasn't thinking about golden palace at the time. What I was thinking is, how are they going to upend this for all these Women to stay together.

Nikki: Oh, okay.

Salina: So I was waiting for a ball to drop. and so when it was Stan.

Nikki: I was like, what?

Salina: I was, like, more surprised than people at the end of Sixth Sense. I. You know. so I thought that was. And then I thought he was going to profess his love to her. and then it was his blood. So I was like, I'm terrible at this.

Nikki: It was just surprise after surprise for you. That must have been a tough watch.

Salina: It was so tough. And then you really caught the. The rest of them earlier on. Just to say that. That I love you on the way out the door. And everything was. I hate to say it, but it was golden, you know, it just really was.

Nikki: It was beautiful.

Can we just say out loud that Lucas is played by Wesley Nielsen

Salina: So those are all my cheesecake moments before we close. I just wanted to check in. Do you have any other others? Any strays at all?

Nikki: Oh, no.

Salina: Okay, so I'm just going to mention I just have one.

Nikki: Okay.

Salina: Usually I'd have a list, so. I'm growing, Nikki. This is growth. I just need to say. Can we just say out loud that Lucas is played by Wesley Nielsen?

Nikki: Oh, yeah.

Salina: My God.

Nikki: I was going to bring it up, and then, you had made a point the last time we recorded that maybe we need to do at some point just, like, a running list of all the cameo. This isn't even a cameo.

Salina: That one was too big.

Nikki: Yeah.

Salina: Yeah, that one was too big. I was like. And I was also confused because I haven't seen him in a role like this. Really. Now, m. I don't know if you know this or not, but he actually started out as a serious actor, so I know he's, like, probably best known for, like, the Naked Gun stuff.

Nikki: Well, I mean, certainly for people our age.

Salina: Yes. And I think for, like, also, he is playing, like, a drier kind of male version of her. Really. so we're not. This isn't the same, like, goofball energy. And I think that's really the last thing I've seen. Is that real? Like, oh, I tripped down and farted. You know, like, kind of energy that he brought to that movie. So it actually took me, I want to say, a stupid amount of time to go, oh, wait a second. Oh, like, three minutes. Minutes. Like a solid three minutes of camera time with him. And then I was like, my God, that's literally. I was watching on my phone, too.

Nikki: Oh, yeah, that makes a difference.

Salina: small, and he was rocking a Southern accent.

Nikki: He doesn't sound like him.

Salina: yeah, I was all sorts of confused, but that's my only stray. I just needed to say it.

Nikki: Okay. Thank you for sharing.

Thank you, Salina, for dropping me a line after our last recording

Anything else you'd like to share before we find our way out of here?

Salina: Where's the door?

Nikki: So stuck.

Salina: So sleepy.

Nikki: Let's take the door that says Rose Nyland. That'll be our next episode.

Salina: Goodness.

Nikki: Okay, that's gonna be a fun one.

Salina: Yes.

Nikki: Because, I mean, Betty White. I just have to say it. Betty White.

Salina: She's a treasure.

Nikki: So, in the meantime, we'd love everyone to follow along with us and engage Instagram and Facebook at sweet tea and TV tick tock at SweetTVPod. We're on YouTube at SweetTV7371, and our email address is SweetTVPod gmail.com. thank you, Salina, for dropping me a line after our last recording so that I didn't feel like I was hanging out all alone on our Gmail inbox. She did, in fact, send me an email to say, you're doing great. Or something like that. That was lovely. Thank you.

Salina: And it was so nice until you sent me back a middle finger emoji.

Nikki: Not true.

Salina: I know the real Nikki.

Nikki: Our website is www.sweettv.com. you can support the show by telling your family and friends about us. Rate or review the podcast wherever you listen. And then there's some additional ways to support the show from our website on the Support Us page. And then come back Thursday. Have we teased it enough? You're extra. And it is your extra sugar, Salina. I hope you're ready, because I'm not. Do you want to tell us about it?

Salina: I'm ready. We'll be talking about Bea Arthur, and we're going to talk about some of her non Golden Girls legacy. I don't know that that necessarily gets everyone, but it should, because let me tell you, she's a badass. That's all.

Nikki: That's all. That should be enough to get people in.

Salina: I, hope so.

Nikki: All right, well, you know what that means, Salina?

Salina: It means we'll see you around the bend.

Nikki: And thanks for being a friend.

Salina: Oh, and they. And thank you for being a friend. Thank you.

Nikki: We're gonna get it right eventually.

Salina: Thank you. Thank me.

Nikki: Thank Betty White. Thank Bea Arthur.

Salina: Thank Estelle Getty.

Nikki: Thanks, Rue McClanahan. Thank you, Leslie Nielsen.

Salina: Thank you, Leslie.

Nikki: Thank you.

Salina: And bye