Designing Women S7 E4 Extra Sugar: We’re Gonna Get Zen If It’s The Last Thing We Do

All the way back in season 4, in “Bernice’s Sanity Hearing” (which we called “Some LIke Dolls, Some Like Revenge”), Julia said: "I'm saying this is the South, and we're proud of our crazy people. We don't hide them up in the attic. We bring 'em right down to the living room and show 'em off. See, Phyllis, no one in the South ever asks if you have crazy people in your family. They just ask what side they're on.” 

Which leads us to the thesis of this “Extra Sugar”. We’ll poke around in that concept a little bit - what does Bernice’s character show us about mental health and “crazy" in the South? Is there anything in our collective experience that plays out through Bernice’s story? 

And, since we’re a culture in crisis, we’ll end by sharing our own tips for preserving your sanity.

Here are our sources for this segment:

• The State of Mental Health in America and state rankings, from Mental Health America

• Mental Health by the Numbers, from the National Alliance on Mental Illness 

Come on y’all, let’s get into it! 

Or listen on Apple Podcasts | Spotify | Amazon Music.

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Transcript

Hey, Salina.

Hey, Nikki.

Hey, everybody. Welcome to this week's Extra Sugar. So it is always fun talking about Bernice. Her quirkiness makes her unpredictable. And like we just talked about in our, episode about Bernice in season seven, the writers are not afraid to play that up and give us some really big laughs. we used our Bernice episode last season, so that would have been season six, episode four, to explore eccentrics on tv because we were so inspired by her quirkiness. And it's also pretty common archetype and entertainment. So it gave us a really nice, extra sugar. But one thing we haven't really talked about is, the Southern ness of Bernice's eccentricity. So they cleverly call it an arterial flow problem, which I actually think is Southern in and of itself. And we'll get to that in a minute. But, when I think back on the series, in, season four, Bernice's sanity, hearing Julia said, I'm saying this is the south, and. And we're proud of our crazy people. We don't hide them up in the attic. We bring them right down to the living room and show them off. See, Phyllis, no one in the south ever asks if you have crazy people in your family. They just ask what side they're on. So that is probably the thesis statement of this Extra Sugar.

What does Bernice's character show us about mental health

I wanted to poke around in that concept a little bit. What does Bernice's character show us about mental health and quote, unquote, crazy in the South? Is there anything in our collective experience that plays out through Bernice's story?

Can we finish the quote?

Yes.

And what side are your crazy people on? Both. And can't we all relate to that?

Yes. Yes, we can. Multiple people just flashed into my head. and then, because we are a culture in constant crisis for funsies. Selene, what if we end this segment with some of our own tips on mental health?

Yeah. Excuse me if I laugh a little and then cry a little.

I know the tears. The tears will come at some point. Yeah.

But I'll come back to the laughter. It'll be zany.

I like that. Will it be like, that nervous laughter?

Do they.

So, uh, we've talked a lot about Bernice as a character

So, we've talked a lot about Bernice as a character throughout all of our podcast. It's really impossible not to. She always steals the scene every time she shows up. again, another throwback, season two, episode five. That Extra Sugar was a tribute to Alice Ghostly and the unique brand of humor she brings to the table. So I don't want to spend Too much time reminding everybody what kind of character Bernice is. But I do think it's worth revisiting a couple of her storylines that encapsulate, her character. So I'm calling these kind of like Bernice's greatest hits. Like, if I could only pick a handful of episodes to show someone who's never seen the show, what would I give them so that they could get a good idea of the character of Bernice. So I would say season two, episode five, Half An Air Bubble Off. It's the one where Bernice enters a beauty pageant at the senior center. That episode is so quintessentially Bernice that it's actually the one we tied our Alice ghostly tribute to. Are you remembering it, Salina?

Twirling. That's all I.

All I can think of with that episode is the twirling. And I can't remember what the other part says.

Something is right. Everything is right in the world or something. Whatever Suzanne told her to say, I'm sure all our best biggest fans are like, ah. But it is a great. It's a great line that we can all agree on.

Agreed. And it's a great episode for seeing who Bernice is.

Salina says the sanity hearing and the mystery episodes are her favorites

So the next one is the one I just quoted, which is season four, episode seven, Bernice's Sanity Hearing. So Bernice's niece Phyllis comes to Atlanta to try to have her declared mentally incompetent, largely so she can have access to all of Bernice's possessions. But you really get a sense, they tried to show you why her niece might think she's crazy. So I think it's just a really good essence of her. And then after you've watched through season seven, I think people should go way back to season two and watch her in season two, episode 20, how great thou Art. So this is the one where Charlene finds out her minister doesn't want women to be able to preach and then tries to persuade him to change his position. Bernice plays a really big, cogent role in the discussion with the minister. And it's just a super quick reminder of the multitudes that Bernice possesses. And it was just a really powerful debate that she had with the minister from a very unlikely character. Did I miss any? Salina, are there any that you would point to?

Well, there's a lot of, like, arterial flow situations, but I think the three that you picked are excellent. And it just happens to be that the sanity hearing one and the women in the mystery episodes are two of my favorite across the entire series. I Think about both of those episodes a lot, actually.

I don't think this. I don't think I realized until, we watched this season how pivotal the, how great Thou art really was for showing you what Designing Women can be at its best. And so we've boiled it down. I sort of see the argument of mega fans that we've boiled it down to some really funny lines from Bernice. But getting to watch her be the unlikely character who, volleys biblical verses back and forth is really powerful and worth a watch.

It's so good. It's like an amazing four minutes of television.

That's good.

Each episode of Designing Women explores mental health through a comedic lens

So the other thing that each of these episodes had for me when I thought about it through this lens of mental health was a few common threads. so the ladies and Anthony all love Bernice, and they protect her fiercely, but they're also really quick to brush off a lot of her input and experiences as being affected by her arterial flow problems or just Bernice being difficult. and ultimately a lot of the portrayal of her eccentricity or differentness boils down to being played for laughs. So I'm bringing those common threads up because I think they're interrelated to this broader discussion about mental health, particularly in the South. So, for instance, I bring up the humor piece of it. I don't want to spend a ton of time here because I think this is a place where Designing Women was sort of a product of its time. And I don't want to ding it unnecessarily, but I think it's worth noting that using mental health as a thing to joke about or laugh about is a structural factor that actually fuels a lot of stigma around mental health. So it's really easy to laugh at people who are different or a little zany. And it makes for. Really, It makes for good humor, honestly. But it's also a little bit of what makes, it so hard for people to accept sometimes that they have mental health or that someone around them has mental health, because there's a little bit of a stigma with it. You don't want to be that weirdo, zany person.

In traditional Southern families, family takes care of them,

So I wanted to mention that, I also wanted to mention that bit about them protecting Bernice a lot. because I think in traditional Southern families, it is like Julia said early in the season, or early in the series, so their family takes care of them, knowing all their ups and downs, and, they protect them. And I think that certainly plays out in this show. And. And then in that vein of the cast Talking about her arterial flow problems, I wanted to mention just that we Southerners have come up with hundreds of creative ways to talk about people like Bernice in the south so that we don't have to call it what it is. We've even heard some of them throughout the series. So we talk about off the beam, an air bubble off, and then of course, arterial flow problems. But I wonder if some of that, like the flowy words to avoid calling it what it is. Covering people up in family members and protection from family members has led to what we're seeing in modern society, which is a bit of a mental health crisis in the south, which is what it is, a growing crisis, especially in rural areas, of which the south is obviously disproportionately comprised. I don't want to throw a ton of numbers at you, but I think a couple might help paint the picture. And then I'll link to the rest in the show notes if you want to poke around later.

25 million rural Americans live in a mental health professional shortage area

I wanted to mention that Broadly speaking, in 2021-2022, 23% of U.S. adults experienced a mental illness in the past year. So that's 60 million people. According to Mental Health America, there are 340 people for every one mental health provider in the U.S. though that may be an overstatement of providers. So they actually think they might have underestimated the number of people per provider. the south is pretty on par with national prevalence. I honestly was shocked to find that only two southern states fall below the line. Mental Health America considers as, quote, higher prevalence of mental illness and lower rates of access to care. So that was Mississippi and Alabama. But it is that latter half access to care that I think probably affects the south, especially rural areas, more than others. So 25 million rural Americans live in a mental health professional shortage area where. Which means it's an area where there are too few providers to meet demand. Compared to suburban and urban residents, rural Americans must travel two times as far to their nearest hospital and are two times as likely to lack broadband Internet, which obviously would limit access to things like telehealth. and then among US adults in non metropolitan areas in 2020, 48% of mental illness receive treatment and 62% with serious mental illness received treatment. So there's a pretty big gap of people who need it who aren't rece receiving treatment.

How do we start shifting the conversation about mental health in the south

so then I wanted to talk a little bit about how key Southern cultural cornerstones. So we talk a lot about family, reputation and religion, how those things might shape the way Southerners deal With mental health. And then more importantly, how do we start shifting that conversation? So I want to start with family. I think most people in the south are familiar with, like, the we don't talk about that sort of vibe. yeah, so, like, in Southern families, loyalty is everything. So the idea that you might air your dirty laundry in therapy, much less, like, with friends or whatever, even if it's just your own struggles, that can feel like a betrayal to your family. So if you grew up in a what happens in this house, stays in this house kind of home, the idea of talking to a stranger about your problems might feel foreign or even shameful. That's definitely something I've dealt with in my own experience with therapy. I felt some sort of shame about talking about difficult relationships in my family because I felt like I was not being loyal to them.

Yes, I. I'm definitely aware of the, like, just don't talk about it. Push it down WASPy kind of. Because that is also WASPy in addition to Southern. I think for me, my family doesn't abide.

Different.

That's actually our tagline.

Different in that way, I meant. But,

In multiple ways, my family was, at least my mom's side, I think most people were into. My grandma was a facilitator and big, believer in therapy. My mom was a big believer in therapy. I've been to therapy multiple times since I was a small child. That is unusual, though. But what I was going to say to your point is it is very strange sometimes to sit across from someone and feel like you're talking about somebody in a way that may not be very nice.

Super flattering.

Yeah. Because, you know, I mean, people are complicated and there might be reasons why things happened, and it's. It's tough, but it's still important, I think, is the bottom line there.

Yeah, I think, the other thing that might be different these days is that you have a lot, that you used to have more family around to take care of you and look out for you, so you didn't need to leave the family for support. I feel like family structure, particularly in the south, and I say this through my own family, but it's really splintered a lot in modern society. Like, I feel like we've left maybe a generation or two of people who just don't know what to do when they have a mental health crisis. So, you know, that quote from Julia basically alludes to the fact that family is always around and there to protect you. And certainly Bernice Found her group with the Sugar Bakers crew. But what happens when families are splintered by, you know, moving to a city for work or moving m. Anywhere for work and your family splinters? You don't have that family to turn to or to protect you anymore. And who are they looking to and who are they going with? So, like my own family, thinking about my mom's side of the family, it's a large part of the family, and they all live within a few mile radius of each other. That's the way it's always been. But then as the family has sort of splintered over the years, you know, we never really lived as part of that group. Like, where, where do they turn to? And I don't know that our experience was necessarily unique. and I just feel like that leaves family not knowing or people not knowing who to turn to when their family's not nearby.

That's fair.

Yeah.

I, mean, my dad's always. Not always, but probably since I was a small child, lived somewhere else, and I've often thought about him and how challenging that must be to not have that safety net or support nearby because obviously, like, it is nice to have someone to turn to and like, I would also like to throw in that found family could be very nice for that too. If your family's, I don't want to say insane, because that feels like counter productive to this segment, but let's just say your family might not be helpful.

Or, you know, not don't, have the tools to help you or, you know, I also think there's just value sometimes in going outside of the, outside of the bubble to gut check yourself and for a little extra support.

It's loving from a distance.

Yes. So I think we'll talk, we'll talk about found family in a little while when I talk about some of, some of the things that I use. And I think you'll identify that if it's not on your list, Salina, I think you will definitely identify with the idea of found family as a useful mental health tool. and I should have probably teed up this discussion about mental health in the south by saying this is not exclusively Southern. And I fully acknowledge that. I think every culture in every region has some common threads. This just felt particularly relevant to my experience in the South. South.

It's a Southern podcast.

It's just, you know, thanks for bringing.

It back to the South, Nikki.

We're trying.

The south has a long tradition of avoiding talking about mental health

The next one I wanted to talk about was reputation. So this idea of sort of like, what will the neighbors say. I think we definitely take pride in the south in being polite, proper and presentable. And that can be super charming. But it can also mean that we have sort of this long tradition. I think what you alluded to a couple minutes ago of, like, handling things yourself. Therapy. What? No, that's for famous rich people. Or like medication. Oh, that's only for the truly crazy. You have to be really bad off for medication. And no one can know about any of those things if you do those things. I think we also, in the south have that long history of using soft and roundabout language when it comes to talking about a lot of things that we think are unsavory, but especially mental health. So we don't say someone was depressed. We say they were going through a rough patch. we don't say that they're anxious, they're just a little high strung. we don't say if, you know, like, if someone's really struggling with something, we just, like, say, bless their heart, they've always been a little bit different. We don't say they have ptsd. We don't say she has high functioning anxiety. We use this flowery language. and I think, unfortunately, that means, when we focus on reputation and not wanting to talk about these things, it means people just suffer in silence. they would rather do that than be the talk of the town or someone that people are gossiping about.

Yeah, I mean, and I. The other thing too, in all fairness is I've never grown up in a small town. So, I mean, I grew up in the suburbs, but it wasn't small. It wasn't like, where everyone goes to the same, like, doctor, you know what I'm saying? Like, I did. It just. I don't have that kind of experience. And I do think that really, like, brings in the scrutiny in a way that, like, I just. I can't. I can, like, try and understand, but I can't really.

Yeah. And, this one in particular is one that I don't think is exclusive to the south at all. Like, I think we've all seen things about Rosemary Kennedy, for instance, where she was sort of tucked away to, disguise or hide mental illness. And I know she's not the only one. but I do think reputation is kind of an acute piece of the Southern experience. So I at least wanted to mention it as part of the puzzle.

In the South, religion plays a complicated role in mental health

And, then the last one I wanted to mention was religions. Sort of this concept of, like, have you tried praying? Did you. Did you try to pray over it. and I think, of course, faith can be a super wonderful source of comfort, and it can bring communities together. But in the South, I think it plays a complicated role in mental health. So for many generations, the solution to anxiety or depression wouldn't have been therapy or medication. It would have been prayer or a casserole or, like, going to church on Sunday. And I think, like, the casserole, that part can help. Yeah.

I mean, the praying is also good, but like, praying casserole and sometimes an antidepressant makes the world go round.

So that's exactly it. Like, give it to God is super well intended as a phrase or as something to make you feel good. But I think it can also discourage people from seeking professional help that they might need. So, you know, we've had conditions like addiction or bipolar disorder because of this complicated religious aspect. Sometimes that's seen as a moral failing rather than an actual medical issue. Or you just didn't pray hard enough, or you didn't meditate on it hard enough. And I think, you know, I've certainly heard and had people tell me, God won't give you more than you can handle, which is, like, a lovely sentiment, and I do appreciate that. But if you are really struggling and someone tells you that, wouldn't you then hesitate to admit that maybe you need a little help handling it? That might not be a good thing.

Yeah.

How do we start changing the way we think about mental health

So how do we start changing the way we think about mental health, either in the US Writ large, in society writ large, or specifically in the South? I had a couple of things I wanted to mention. normalizing the conversation. Talking about mental health isn't something that should be taboo. If you, would ask someone. Like, in the middle of this segment, we paused because Salina's having a coughing attack. So I had to ask.

Get another one.

Salina, are you okay? Why would I not also ask you, Salina, you seem not like yourself. Are you okay? Why would I not ask that question? If you're going to talk about the physical stuff, you should be comfortable talking about emotional wellbeing, too.

I actually had that coughing attack just to cue you up, to make that point. Thank you, Salina.

It's perfect.

Perfect.

You always know the right thing to do. the second thing I wanted to mention was, you can expand the toolbox. So prayer, faith, and family support, all of those things are fantastic. And I'm not arguing that any one of them should be left out of the conversation. But I think they can coexist with therapy, medication, and other mental health Resources. we've said here before, it's not always, either or. It can be both. And, it doesn't have to be all of one thing and none of another. It can be both. And I think that would be helpful for people. setting boundaries, I think is one that I really struggle with. But again, being polite, is a Southern ness. It's also a woman ness. And it's something that I have the luxury of having both of those things that push me to always want to be polite. But that doesn't mean we have to put up with everything and we can say no and we can acknowledge that prioritizing mental health isn't selfish. It's just taking care of ourselves, and then finding community. So you referenced this, and I think we'll talk about it here in a minute as well. But if you are worried about being judged, you can find a support group or a therapist who understands your background and values and can help you get the help you need in a non judgmental, context.

Salina says she's finding herself in a mental health space this year

So I wanted to mention that. So like we've said, Salina, personally, I am finding myself in a, mental health space right now. I need, like, a lot of support. it's been a really big time of change in our country, in our society writ large. Me personally, my family is entering the busy season of sports school, the downhill slide to summer. So I'm finding that I need to leverage mental health support a little bit more than normal. I imagine you might be in a similar situation, not the summer sports.

so I can't say that. But, yeah, I think it's fair to say that 2025 is off to a weird start. Yeah, I mean, there's changes in the country for sure. Meanwhile, the west coast was on fire for like 24 days, and the east coast and the south turned to ice. It's like a bad Game of Thrones metaphor that we're somehow stuck in the middle of. And then, you know, there's the DC plane crash with the American Airlines flight and the military helicopter and. And that was just January.

I know.

You know, that was just the first, the first month. It was a very long month. So, yeah, I would definitely say. And I like that you didn't say good or bad. You just said you're in a mental health space. And I feel you on that.

It's just sometimes the volume, of stuff that's coming at us is just too much to keep up with. And you're. You feel like you're constantly scrambling to keep up with it. And people always joke that January is like 65 days long. It just is. Like when you're coming off the holidays, it's a little bit of like an extended hangover. Like, it is that way. This year has been particularly acute.

Nancy says finding a group of friends can help during tough times

So I thought maybe it made sense for us to talk about a couple of the things that we're doing ourselves to try to keep ourselves sane right now. so my first one was just find a group. You talked about found family. That's exactly what I mean with this one. I, think, you know, I always try to just like suck it up and move forward, which I do think is a little bit of Southern stigma at play. But I was going through a really rough patch recently and was a little bit of, you know, I don't want to be the person that drops into group text and is like, my whole world's falling apart.

Yes.

Or like, what a tough time for me. So I don't. And every now and then you'll have a friend who just like explicitly asks. And this happened to me recently where I just put it out there. Like, I don't want to be negative Nancy, but this is what's going on for me. And they were like, be negative Nancy. That's okay. So we ended up scheduling. You know, we had been already kind of working out a girl's day, but we ended up scheduling it. And I said, I just feel like I'm not going to show up as like the person you want to hang out with. And they were like, we've known you for almost 20 years. Like, we love you. However you show up, just show up. And I did. And it was so powerful and it was so healing and I think that that's. That can be really helpful.

Yeah, I, My friends have always been my rock. And I think we both have some really long term friendships. I mean, two of the girls in my girls group, I've been friends with one of them since I was nine years old and the other one since I was 11. Like, I'm M39 and they are actually two of the people I'm the closest to out of that larger group of nine, ten girls, you know. And, I just think in tough times, when there is someone who can truly see you and still love you and help you through, like anybody can be with you to have a fun time. You know, anybody can go to the bar with you if someone picks you up off the floor when you've lost your you know what and carries you to where you need to go. Next. That's the people that I want in my corner, you know. And so I think about that a lot. I, do have some friends that I think Casey and I both consider film family. And like, and probably because we all have families that sometimes they drive us to our film families.

I think everybody does.

I think that's true. And I think normalizing that is really important. and I think you also like, even knowing somebody since I was nine, I don't come to the same, I don't come to the table with the same baggage that I do with like someone who, like I'm actually family with. So, very important.

I think that we're talking about friends we've had for a long time. But I also think there are friends that you make at certain chapters in your life that can be very healing, as well. And it's really hard to make friends at ah, honestly at our age, it's really hard to make friends because you don't have time. But like, for me, you know, I've met some moms who have been really, really encouraging to me at times where I've really needed it. We are not best friends that I text them when something horrible is happening in my life and they show up with flowers and soup and whatever. But I can certainly text them and say I'm dealing with this issue, what do I do? And they give advice and they help. And so I think, found friends don't always have to be people you've known a zillion years. They can also be someone who's just floated into your life recently and serves a really useful purpose.

Or we all have these like segments of our lives. So like work friends.

Right.

You're my film family can't identify with that.

Right.

Like they can sympathize, but they can't truly understand what a day to day situation feels like. And so I think it's incredibly valuable to have those people as well. And those can be short term or long term. They can come in all kinds of varieties and shapes and forms. But sometimes you need that just to get through the day. I also want to say like, I'm not on the verge of crying, but my voice is getting very shaky because of how dry my throat is. So I don't want anybody to think I'm falling apart. It's okay to cry, but I will let you know when that is happening and it's not right now.

All good.

Making space for a Hobby can help you relax and unwind

So yeah, the second one I wanted to mention was making space for a Hobby. I'm actually worried that more adults don't have hobbies, especially ones that fall in the creative space. Like, I actually actively feel my brain unwind when I put a puzzle together or work on a cross stitch, or help my daughter with a not messy craft. I think it's really healing and it's also super gratifying and satisfying because you have a thing at the end of it. And I think that that sort of decompression, whatever that hobby looks like for you, I think it's really important. And I would recommend that for anyone to try something new or something old you just haven't tried in a while, but allows you to shut your brain off.

Does a podcast count?

I think so.

And how about setting up a new house?

I think so.

Great.

Decorate.

I'm, doing wonderful.

Check, check.

I mean, I. Okay this.

Since last April, I've been journaling just about every day

I've got one that I want to share. It's not necessarily a hobby, but it's something that takes up a kind of significant amount of time and it is something that kind of gets my brain together. So since last April, I've been journaling just about every day. So each day I follow a standard template. Typically, I'd write down one simple goal, like just being present for the day or being like, kind and gentle with myself. Because I tend to be the roughest on me. I do one to three affirmations, one to three things I'm grateful for, one to three things I see in my future when I'm upset about something, or I just want to explore something that came across my brain in the meditation. I do like a brain dump and have had some pretty helpful insights there. What's also nice is that these are things that are backed up by brain science. It's not things that I'm just doing for fun. And so it can help you get in a better head space for the day, yes, but also for the long haul if you keep up with the practice. And it's been incredibly valuable for me.

You inspired me to start journaling, so I found A list of 365 journal prompts and I started, I think I started on January 1st, but I might have started a couple days before. But I've tried to keep up with it. I think for me, sometimes it becomes a little bit of a one more thing to do and one more box to check. So if I'm feeling that way, I will skip a day. Because what I don't want it to become is that I want it to be something that encourages me to self reflect. And explore. And if I feel like it's something I'm rushing through just to check a box, is that really useful?

I realized I was getting, like, a little obsessive about it. So I think we all have to watch ourselves to be fair. And again, be gentle with you today.

I think that's probably my biggest, journey that I'm on right now at this particular point in my life is figuring out when to give myself grace and when to push myself a little bit. Because I don't want to downshift to coasting. Because, like, I don't want to live life just sort of coasting. I want to explore things and try new stuff, but also don't want to do it because I hate myself or I'm punishing myself. You know what I mean?

I think that's fair.

Salina: 10% happier podcast with Dan Harris gives practical meditation tips

The other one I wanted to talk about was Read or consume Empowering Things. So I understand that not everybody is a reader. but podcasts and audiobooks also exist. but I love a thing that gives me an action in a time where I feel, like, super stymied or lost. Like I told you, Salina, I don't know if we talked about it here on the podcast, but the 10% happier podcast with Dan Harris gives really practical advice and tips on a range of topics. They're generally about life and sort of how you, show up for yourself and how you go about life. But I love when I finish listening to a podcast or I finish reading a book, and I feel like I can do that. I can try that. and I think that sometimes you need to just consume things passively and just let your brain shut off. But sometimes just replacing that with something that gives you something practical that you can actually do something about can be really empowering.

Okay, so in the fall, I started meditating, and actually, thanks to you, is how. That's how I learned about Dan Harris and his podcast, where a lot of those practical tips are about meditation. And, they also have a lot of guests who do short meditations, which I think is really nice because I think that's achievable. And I think so many times. And something that I've been learning in my practice is, am I.

It's.

I'm not Buddha. I'm crazy. You know what I'm saying? Like, I'm an insane person. And so. And I'm. I'm. I want to be very careful because I'm not trying to be stigmatizing, but I'm saying, like, I'm a frenetic. Anxious, stressful person. But I'm doing something about it and I'm actively trying to do something about it and I'm catching myself. And there's so much fear around failure with meditation. And I've really been trying to be gentle with me just the same way that I would be gentle with you or anyone else. And I think it's been incredibly valuable. I think the fact that Dan Harris does a lot of these like six minute ones or like one minute, give yourself one minute to breathe, give yourself one minute to close your eyes or focus somewhere else, I think that's incredibly helpful. for people who get into the spin, one might say it was me. Nikki might tell you that I'm the most spinned out person that she knows. It's hard to say, but I don't know.

Between the two of us, spun out in different ways.

I don't. I don't know. You carry it more gracefully. I'm like, I also read his and Jeff Warren's book. I know that you and I have talked offline about this meditation for the fidgety skeptic. Hello, my name is Salina and I'm a fidgety skeptic. but you know, I thought it was funny, I thought it was insightful. And that also has several meditations that you can return to. And I like it because it's very like you're gonna have intrusive thoughts.

That's called having a brain. And so these meditations tackle that head on. Oh, planning. Patty, you're here today. We'll take a seat. Would you like an aperitif? And like, I love that. I think that's so great. Just embrace it. And that's what I want to do. I want to let things go and I want to embrace the things that matter for me. And it can't all matter or you'll fall apart. And the reason I know is because.

I've fallen apart a few times. You know, we finished, our. I think it was. We finished last season and. Or maybe it was the season before and I was heading into the summer and it took me a good solid two weeks for my brain to sort of completely decompress. And as I was parsing through how that all was feeling, I mean, it obviously wasn't just the podcast. It was all the things that had been leading up to us hitting that finish line. it was finish line in a lot of places. And I just remember waking up one day and being like, okay, you are safe, you are comfortable. You are healthy. And I come back to that. It m. Just crossed my mind one day, and I realized I had been so stuck in fight or flight and trying to, like, just push through to the next thing that, you know, I. I would say, like, I don't have a minute to stop and think. No, you always have a minute to stop and think. And sometimes in the middle of the day, your body and your brain needs to hear, I am safe. I am healthy, and I can be happy. Like, just, you're safe. Sometimes I just need to tell myself I'm safe. That is the same thing as meditating. It's the same thing. Just telling yourself something.

It's all in the sauce.

Salina says meditation is helping with stress and anxiety

at this point, because we mentioned the practical tools, would you be okay with me mentioning a few that I've gotten along the way if I said no? I would say, all right. Move along.

Yes, Salina, move along.

You a hole. All right. So, some of the things that have been working for me now, I think meditation is kind of helping with this, where I'm not having to do it as much. But in the beginning and before I was meditating, I found myself needing to do this more often. And so I activate my prefrontal cortex, and there's a lot of ways to do it.

Which button do you push for that?

Just an eyeball with a needle. so, you know, if I'm stressed out or I find myself spinning out, which I'm like, I. I'm telling you, I'm so good at it that, like, I could teach a class in that if anybody ever needs one. like, for calm people. I think I should do that as, like, a joke. Yeah, you're too calm. Come to my class. but you can look up into the light, and it can be just like a light in your room. I wouldn't suggest the sun.

Really Seems like a bad idea.

Yeah, but you can count backwards from, like, 10. You can spell your name backwards. I'm like, well, that's gonna do is just, like, throw me off entirely. I'm like, I don't even remember what I was stressed about. Can't even spell four words. and then this is sort of like that idea of, like, talking to the intrusive thoughts, but with your anxiety. So talk to your anxiety instead of ignoring it or pushing it down. And I know it sounds a little silly, but, like, I promise it feels better than just letting it overtake you. And that's to go like, well, hello there. I see you. And you know what you're welcome to come in and you can take a seat. But you're not welcome to take over my day. And I think that acknowledgement is so very important and has played a really big role. And I'm not saying I don't snap. So I never want people to, like, feel like, Because I'm not. We're all imperfect, but if we're all doing it, I'm trying not to say trying anymore. See how well it's working. If we're all doing it, then we're probably going to be in a slightly better position. And I don't. I'm with Dan Harris. I would like to be 10% happier. That sounds amazing.

Sounds amazing.

I love how pragmatic that is.

Yeah.

One suggestion is having a comfort show when going through tough times

the next one I wanted to suggest is having a comfort show or, like, record or album. So, like, when you don't have it in you to be proactive or active, you don't have it in you to meditate or, read a positive book. Like, you just don't. You just want to turn your brain off for a minute, have a show that you like to put on, have some music you like to listen to. I always call it like, putting on a security blanket. Like, I have certain music that when it turns on, I feel like someone just put a blanket over me. But find whatever that is for you and then exploit it. When you're going through a tough time, allow yourself that space, because it will. Once your brain has recovered and once your body has recovered, it'll allow you to go back to some of the more active stuff.

I love that you're saying exploit, Exploit it.

Yeah.

You know, don't exploit people.

No.

Don't exploit resources. No. But definitely exploit music and exploit friends or whatever is your bag, you know, I think that is so smart.

King of Queens for me, as if. I don't know, lately it's been Kimmy Schmidt. but King of Queens is my comfort show. And I finally. I finally broke down for the first couple of weeks of the year. Up until maybe about four days ago, I had read every night before bed, because when I read, it makes my brain really sleepy. but something happened, and I just couldn't read anymore. So I started turning on King of Queens anymore. And I'll do that for a couple days till I feel safe again.

I like it. It's okay to want to feel safe. You know, what a place to be, safety. so I've listened to a lot of music lately. I would actually say that I think those things can be meditative too, you know, I think, you know, you hear people like I'm kind of meditating while I'm gardening or one thing that I want to get into is walking meditations. I'm like, I'm trying to wrap my mind around the amount of traffic that's around where I live. So I would like to do that safely. but that is something I'm very interested in. And actually I met with someone recently and they were, they're kind of like in the woo woo space. And they were like, if there was ever someone built for walking meditation.

Yeah, yeah. So I was like, oh, skeptic, fidget better while walking.

Yeah, get that fidget out. So as I'm like standing and like wiggling around, so you know, in times of chaos, it's hard for my brain to settle or concentrate. So like the music is really helpful because instead of me like just trying to sit there, I'm running around, I'm dancing. That's why it's like living with a Disney character. Because if I'm upset, I'm gonna go shimmy down the stairs.

So were the Disney princesses all anxious?

You know, they were. You know, you know it and I know it. And I'm sure there's a good set of memes out there somewhere about it. embarrassingly, Nikki, also, I know, you know, I dance around the house. I do, I know it. Like Nikki loves it. She's also always dancing around her house.

You know, that's me.

But you gotta, you gotta break for whatever it is, you know, even when you were talking about doing cross stitch and those things too. I think those can also be meditative.

Yeah, absolutely.

And it is sort of bringing you into the present. And that's what meditation is about.

It's about making sure that we're not always living out in the, I don't know, the universe, you know, that we're somehow finding a way to stay grounded.

one of the peloton instructors says, at the beginning of every meditation, she says, now take a deep breath and find yourself in your cocoon, in your shell, in the safety ness of your mind and your body. And that to me is it. It does take someone saying that for me to pull myself back into myself rather than having my brain live out in the rest of the universe with everybody else where it's loud and chaotic.

I love, I live. I love you. I do live. I'm using one app and every time she says, this is your time, and I'm like, yeah, yes, my Time.

There's some empowerment to that. It feels good.

The next to last one I wanted to suggest was go outside

So the last one I wanted to. The next to last one I wanted to suggest was go outside. so I struggle a lot in the winter, which also is why January, February and like the first half of March are just super hard for me. 2025 has been wacky for all the reasons, but also I just struggle in the winter in general. I also struggle in the late summer when it's like oppressively hot and going outside is terrible. but I also crave sunshine and fresh air. If I don't get it, I am miserable. There are no other words for it. So I would suggest to other people, if you are like that, do what it takes to get outside. Like bundle up, strip down, do whatever you need to do, but get out there. I've definitely gone on walks this year through this winter where I've had to like completely bundle up. And it's my worst case scenario because I don't like to be cold, but I've just out. Like the sunshine outweighs the coldness and it's what I have to do. I just need fresh air. And I think that, I think there is some science on that. Like the idea of touching grass and being one with nature. There was also a lot of interesting discussion as I was researching this segment. It just didn't make it into the, into the broader narrative. But one of the reasons people think that mental health might actually be better in the south is because we have so much more access to fresh air and nature and open spaces. Mental, health is by default. Sorry, Salina. Worse in urban areas because you don't have access to that open space and that freshness which humans need because it's what we're of, it's what we're from.

That's, that's interesting. And I often feel you. It's a little bit like a dopamine hit.

When you get out there.

Yeah.

So I would just say I, I definitely agree with you. For me, outdoors, not outdoors, I got, I got to be moving. So working out, staying active has been a huge part of a, keep your head clear routine for me for about 18 years. So I'm very active, I have a lot of energy and it's got to go somewhere. So my workouts are also very important to me.

and then of course the last one is just don't be afraid of professional help. So seeking therapy or counseling is a way to understand yourself better, not something to feel ashamed of. You don't have to be ashamed to tell someone that you asked for help and therapy. I've been to therapy a few times. one time I, it was after I lost my brother and I was dealing with ptsd. That was a very different therapy experience than the therapy I underwent like just this last year where I just talked about the anxiety I was feeling, just about the world in general and the life that I was living. so there are different types of therapy experiences. You can go for very acute things and it can be very helpful. some in my experience are more comfortable than others, but I do think there's some value in kind of pushing through the discomforts, because I think it helps you understand yourself better and it helps you understand the world better.

So yes. And I am a huge advocate for therapy. Like I said earlier, my, I was raised that way. I, I am one, way that I am fortunate is that I didn't ever really have that stigma attached to therapy. To me it was more of like a foregone conclusion. But I had also had a lot of time off the couch until my sister in law died. And then I was like, no, it's time to get back on the couch. And so I'm very grateful that I did that. A lot of the tools that I've shared tips have come from the person that I've been going to since last year. She's actually in Costa Rica. And I'm sharing that because one of the things that Covid did for us was open up these virtual opportunities. All of these virtual platforms you can get on video chat and still get really something useful out of it. so that way you're not having to fight traffic or stress about losing part of your day. You just jump right on. I take the call from my phone and over the summer, another thing that happened in the middle of all of this, like trying to figure out how to work through my grief was I wound up hurting my back when we moved. And so for the first time in many years I had to go see a chiropractor again. And I hadn't done that in a long time. probably since I was like 19 or 20 the last time I totally wrecked my back. Like every 19 year old. I thought that's when you were supposed to be fine, you know, not me. so. But it's a different type of chiropractor. They're not a regular crack and pop kind of doctor.

Oh, then what's the point? I only want the cracking and the popping.

There's still adjustments, but it's called network chiropractic, where they use light pressure on the spine to help guide it into alignment. But it's also been proven to help with joint pain, arthritis, sciatica, chronic fatigue, anxiety, and depression. Right now I wish it would help with this chronic cough that I have. That would be wonderful. And it's not just physical. It's like, body energy work. This is where I'm probably. I'm afraid I'm going to lose Nikki. But I've been working on my body mind connection. I can't even look at Nikki. I'm like, blocking.

I believe in body mind connection.

Well, hold on. I don't think that's where I'm gonna lose you.

Okay.

Keeping my chakras or energy centers, in the body open and balanced. And, I don't know, it's working for me. And it's led me to other authors and healing techniques and things that have been interesting for me to explore, like traumas stored in the body. Not like I want to live in these traumas again, but, like, how can I get past this, you know, and not, like, be addicted to my own emotions? Which is crazy because it's not like you're like, well, it feels good to feel like crap, but you're so used to it, you keep doing it again and again and again.

Because it almost, becomes easy.

Yes.

It's easier to just do what you've always done rather than fight against it or try to fix it.

Salina: How do you heal your body and your mind

It feels weird maybe to feel good when you felt bad for so long. And so, you know, how do you heal your body and your mind? Like, is really something that I've been working on a lot doing. I'll catch myself. And then the last thing I'll say is, like, I'll try and share some resources and, well, I'll ask Nikki to please help me share some resources in our blog posts if it's helpful for anyone, including both the platform where I see my therapist and then, the person that I see, the chiropractor I see is here in Atlanta. And so if people are here, then they could go see him and see if that's something that works for them.

Yeah. Thanks, Salina.

Bernice says mental health in the South is still a work in progress

So with that, ready to wrap this baby up?

Let's wrap this baby up.

thanks for going on that fact finding mission with us to explore Bernice as a character and what she says about mental health in the South. Ultimately, like, mental health elsewhere in the country and probably the world. It's a work in progress that's challenged by some historic social norm, but maybe it's starting to move in the right direction. And I'm super grateful that we have this platform so that at least you and I can do our part to help normalize the discussion. you know, I think as we're moving in, in whatever the right direction is, hopefully in the meantime, the best we can do and what we will do is take care of ourselves and take care of each other. We kind of owe it to each other and we can't do it without each other. so you guys know what we always say. Thank you for listening. You can go to our website, www.sweettv.com. you can find us on the socials, blah, blah. but take care of yourself, take care of each other, show up for one another and be kind to one another. And don't be afraid to take time for yourself. That is really, really important, especially when we're going through really difficult times or times of change. So with that, we'll say that's been this week's extra sugar.